This Place is Death
1 year ago by WillRead more: Jin, season 5
Now that we know Jin is indeed alive, what will we find out this week about how he has experienced the time skipping while floating around in the ocean? Interestingly enough, he must have stayed within the perimeter of the Island following the explosion of the freighter last season, or the conclusion to last week’s episode would not have been possible. Also – this could be the episode where we learn about Rousseau’s past and how she came to be the only one left of her crew – the title of the episode is ominous enough!
ABC’s Official Show Description
Spoiler Alert
“Locke takes on the burden to stop the island’s increasingly violent shifts through time. Meanwhile, Ben hits a roadblock in his attempt to reunite the Oceanic 6 and bring them back to the island.”
We know that going into this episode Locke’s attempt to stop the time shifts is tied to the Orchid. Also, based on Jin’s chance meeting with Rousseau last week, we see that she is already pregnant when arriving at the Island – so that begs the question of whether/when she and Ben previously met. It is difficult to judge if there will be a central character in this episode – if I had to bet, I would say either Locke or Jin, but we only have a few hours until we find out.
Comment 1, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I love this blog and so when I created a new aggregation/syndication site all about LOST, I included this one. Just wanted you to know. It’ called LOST soup and it’s at http://lost.soup.io if you want to check it out.
Keep up the great LOST blogging. Love it!
Comment 2, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
So I wonder where in the world Locke will end up when he dies on the island (if in fact he does actually “die”). How does Ben know where to find him since he himself ended up in a Tunisian desert?
Comment 3, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jacob’s Footprint wrote:
I am not entirely sure that Locke will die ON the island… if he did, how would he get OFF the island?
Also, I am not sure he HAS to turn the FDW to get off the island. Ben had ways of traveling to and from the “mainland” as evidenced by the passports, money and photo of him.
Locke may well leave the island by “conventional” methods and find Ben himself. All I know is that 9pm can’t come soon enough!
: ) P
Comment 4, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I agree. It will be very interesting to see how he manages that one. Maybe he will find the Submarine that he blew up and Captain that little bugger right back to LA. Or possibly lasso some sea turtles that he tied together with his back hair…..I cannot wait!
Comment 5, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Is it safe to assume that since Jin is alive, that Micheal could be floating around in the ocean somewhere too?
Comment 6, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jacob’s Footprint wrote:
Didn’t Locke die somewhere in LA as Jack read in the article last season before going to his funeral?
Comment 7, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jason wrote:
IMO, no. Michael was *IN* the room with the C-4. Jin was up on deck waving at the helicopter. *HE* had time to make a flying leap off the freighter.
: ) P
Comment 8, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
Locke’s body is in a death-like state, we have seen that. I think the debate is whether or not he is actually DEAD, or perhaps made to look that way in order to get to O6 to agree to return to the island. OR perhaps he is now in a state like Christian Shepherd, where he is dead OFF the island, but undead ON the island.
: ) P
Comment 9, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
did Locke ever touch base with Ben in order to get back the O6?
Comment 10, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I am very interested to see how Ben will prove to Sun that Jin is still alive.
Of course, he may just be tugging at her heart strings in order to get her back to the island, where he will be “undead” but “dead” back in the regular world.
Sheesh..
Whatever it may be..I love the taste of this Old Lost! :) Feels like we’re really back in business.
Comment 11, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
++++++++++
Agree PJ, you could also make a case that Christian showing up to tell Michael that he ‘can go now’ was D&C’s way of telling us Micheal is dead.
Comment 12, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
can’t wait!
Comment 13, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I don’t think that Locke is dead. My theory is that he was bitten by a Medusa spider and it appears that he is dead. We know the spiders are on the island since Paulo and Nikki were bit and everyone thought they were dead. In the first episode of the year Hugo’s dad (Cheech) was watching the Expose show on TV when Hugo came to his house which reminded me of Paulo and Nikki.
Your thoughts?
Comment 14, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
CRW wrote:
+++++++++++
But Locke likley died off the island. Are the medusa spiders local to L.A.? I’m not sure he’s dead like others have stated, but if NOT, then I think the medusa spider was just away for D&C to tell us that some people APPEAR dead when they are not. In other words, if Locke is not actually dead, he may be drugged to appear so, but the spider were not used, they were just a hint.
Comment 15, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
CRW wrote:
I wouldn’t rule it out, but my guess is that Locke has been dosed up with the same tranquilizer that Sayid had – not necessarily by the same people, he may even have done it to himself. Remember that Carmen Reyes thought Sayid wasn’t breathing. Or Locke may have Medusa Spider venom in him, but I think that it was neither accidental, nor from the bite of a spider – but rather through a syringe. Heck, the dart that hit Sayid might even be Medusa Spider venom!
I agree that Nikki and Paulo’s story is not over. As I have said from the beginning, if it were, D&C wouldn’t keep dropping their breadcrumbs for us. Same with Emma and Zack.
: ) P
Comment 16, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
mylee wrote:
Not that we have seen yet, but Locke went around the country as Jeremy Bentham trying to get the O6 to go back, so it is reasonable to think he DID hook up with Ben – who would have given him the fake name and helped him out with details like money etc., eventually helping him with the “plan” to “die” in order to draw the O6 out and get them to go back. (Was that really all one sentence!!)
CAN’T WAIT UNTIL 9:00!!!!!
Comment 17, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
It still blows my mind that there are basically 3 years on the island that we have not seen and don’t know what happened during. Unless I guess when the 06 finally get back, they will conveniently reappear 3 years in the past…
Comment 18, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
NikkiV wrote:
Locke may have info that would confirm Jin is alive, and he would have in turn passed that information to Ben.
Comment 19, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jacob’s Footprint wrote:
They may try to say that because there’s no rhyme or reason to the time distortion, what would be a few hours on the island in it’s state of flux, would be equivalent to X months in “real world” time. So the whole flashing around could be what was actually taking place in those 3 years.
Comment 20, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jacob’s Footprint wrote:
As I said in the thread for night one (which was episodes 1 and 2), I personally don’t think we are going to SEE three years on the island. I think that Sawyer, Juliet et al (whom I will call the Remaining LOSTies since they are still LOST) are going to skip around in time for a few episodes and then join up with the O6 and whoever else is with them.
From the Remaining LOSTies POV I don’t think that it will FEEL like three years. From the time the helicopter flew overhead and the freighter exploded, they’ve spent what would probably feel like several days to them, skipping around in time. As far as I know, they haven’t slept, though maybe now with all the nose-bleeding that is going on, they will take a rest now and then. I know I am tired just thinking about it!
Anyway, I just don’t think that the Remaining LOSTies are going to be skipping around in time for what feels to THEM as three years before the O6 show up.
JMO,
: ) P
Comment 21, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
That definitely makes sense. It will be weird though for Locke to leave the island (assuming he actually dies off the island, which I am now definitely convinced of) in the middle of the time shifts, arrive in LA some time after Kate, Jack and company returned to the US, then do his thing for 3 years as Jeremy Bentham, “DIE”, and then return back to the island just a few days after he left it (on island time). Man, what a way to give yourself a headache!
Comment 22, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
__________________
We also know that Locke (as Jeremy Bentham) went to see Kate (she told Jack) and probably contacted some other O6ers as well. So he had to get off the island alive.
I agree that he might have hooked up with Ben and is “pretending” to be dead in order to help convince the O6 to go back. This would also explain why Ben knows who is and isn’t alive back on the island.
The only thing that is making me doubt that Locke is alive is that Richard told him he HAD TO DIE to get the O6 back AND the newspaper article also said that Jeremy Betham commited suicide.
Comment 23, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Agree with PJ @ the three years for the ’skippers’ and Locke won’t be in LA for three years being Bentham. He arrives toward the end of the three year deal and ‘dies’ after making his appeals to the O6….I think the clue to this is THAT is what sends Jack into his addiction phase.
So basically the ’skippers’ will skip a few more times after Locke leaves and the ’skippers’ will not experience the same length of time that Locke is gone either.
Comment 24, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
Like many things on LOST, it may have been vaguely stated. He didn’t have time to explain the ‘fake’ part….possibly.
Comment 25, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I agree that Nikki and Paulo’s story is not over. As I have said from the beginning, if it were, D&C wouldn’t keep dropping their breadcrumbs for us. Same with Emma and Zack
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Curious, to what breadcrumbs are you referring? I may have missed something.
Comment 26, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I’ll buy into that one.
Comment 27, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hi my name is lost4ever and I am a LOSTaholic. I hope I remember how to do this quote thing.
PJSander wrote:
How about 70 hours? Hammer, I seem to recall someone saying Locke appeared a month or so before his death (maybe Walt’s grandmother?).
Miraks wrote:
I agree Miraks although there have been very good reasoning behind him still being alive. For me, if Locke was alive, it would take away from the fantastic “who is in the coffin” finale from last year. Therefore, I hope he is dead, as Richard told him he had to die.
Comment 28, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I thought Jack went into his addiction phase before he finds out Locke is dead…just from regular island withdrawal.
Everything happening from this point on off-island is after-the-fact that Locke is dead and their attempts to get back.
Comment 29, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
Excellent Rita. Locke most likely sought Ben out first, or Widmore. After all, Widmore actually found the island once.
Comment 30, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
***********
Also, Christian Shepherd came to Michael right before the freighter blew up and told him something to the effect that he could go now, i.e. the island had finally released him. I am still puzzled about why the island chose to release Michael at that moment and not any other.
Comment 31, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
****
Oh..Sorry.didn’t realize that Hammer had already mentioned that point. Still confused about the timing of the release though.
Comment 32, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
RGS wrote:
+++++++++++
You may be correct, but I still don’t think Locke will be off island for the 3 years. Only the tail end.
Comment 33, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Perhaps Rousseau’s crew will end up with bloody noses or losing ‘time’ like Desmond did. Wasn’t this occurence happening to those who didn’t follow the bearing? So it stands to reason that Rousseau and her crew floated in on a different bearing. Rousseau being pregnant may have protected her somehow.
I think Ben will convince Sun about Jin being alive because he’ll ask Sayid something. Something that Sayid will suddenly remember because Rousseau will have mentioned meeting Jin when she arrived to island. Much the same way Desmond suddenly remembered Faraday. Sayid is on the docks with Sun and Ben at the end of the episode, so its easily a possibility.
I think Locke is indeed DEAD. I think it would be lame for poison or spiders to be culprit. However, I think he’s only as ‘dead’ as Christian was after plane crash.
Comment 34, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Newbie wrote:
*****************************************************
For redemptive reasons. Michael still “had work to do” up until that point.
Comment 35, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I’m hoping they cover a bit more tonight on Rousseau and her crew. There are more than a few things that are still a mystery.
What happened to Brennan? He was still alive the last Danielle knew. “Brennan has taken the keys” “He;s outside right now”
Where did Danielle get all her military style clothing and weaponry? Did she steal them from Dharma or was she possible part of them?
Could it be possible that Dharma knew of her and was using her as an experiment on isolation?
Comment 36, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
**************************************
Of course there are the more obvious questions i could be asking but the above questions were minor questions i thought i could get answers to from your help
Comment 37, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I thought Jack started going downhill after being told that Claire was his sister.
Locke could have went to Widmore because he did briefly met him when they were in that camp in the 1950’s.
With them seeing the light from the hatch (we all know what’s happening there) & Saywer seeing Kate deliver Aaron I thought it was getting closer to ‘present’ times. But then they showed Jin with a young pregnant Rousseau & the crew she crashed with so I am as confused as ever with this time travel.
Comment 38, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
RGS wrote:
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
I was under the impression that Jack started down the addiction path when he started seeing his dead father around…he asks his colleague for a prescription one night when he sees dear old dad in the waiting room of the hospital…wihs i could remember the episode, but i’m sure someone here can refresh my memory…;)
Comment 39, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jen wrote:
this could also be when it started…i cannot recall which came first, but my guess would be it was the combination of the two, plus the fact that Kate starts doing stuff for Sawyer…
Comment 40, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
addicted2lost wrote:
Regarding Nikki and Paulo, there have been several times when “Expose” (the tv show that Nikki was on) has been on television. In S4E7, (“Ji Yeon”), a rerun of Expose is playing on the television in the background. In S5E2, Hurley’s father is watching Expose when he hears Hurley knocking.
If Nikki and Paulo’s storyline was really just one that fizzled and failed, why do D&C keep bringing it up?
Regarding Emma and Zack, several times last season, they were mentioned. There was a shot of a swing set, empty and Sawyer mentioned it. Juliet asked Ben in a flashback about them. If we were not supposed to remember the other kids that were on that plane crash, I don’t think D&C would have characters mention them and essentially remind us they existed.
HTH,
: ) P
Comment 41, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ESB wrote:
+++++++++++++
Yep, all good points. My point may have been off a bit, but I was trying to emphasize the fact that Locke will not have been recruiting the O6 the whole three years because he was busy skipping for awhile.
Comment 42, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I believe that off island is three years into the future but on island it only seems like several days. When O6 return in there minds they have been gone for 3 years but Sawyer, Juliet, et al. would only think of them being gone a week or so. I also believe that they will return to the island sometime in it’s past, possibly when Ben was young and his father worked for Dharma. Also that Rousou never had a memory of Jin until we saw it happen, meaning that originally she did not meet him but because of HIS travels through time she found him in the ocean the 2nd time.
Comment 43, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jen wrote:
~~~~~~~~~~~
They skipped before we saw Jin. The hatch light and Aaron’s birth were at the same time and then flash. New time period. The flashes are random. They just happen to be flipping to times that will hopefully answer some questions for us and then create a whole new set…only 2 1/2 hours to go
Comment 44, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I can’t WAIT to find out more about Danielle. I think we would learn a lot about The Others and the island from her.
So do you think that the memory of the people who see the Losties remember them, or is it only happening on the Losties timeline? Alpert can rememeber them traveling. Is that because he is special, or can everyone?
Comment 45, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Lost Chicka wrote:
+++++++++++++
I think they ALL can remember, but only now that is happened. They can not have remembered it in the episodes from previous seasons because the traveling had not happened yet…..yes I am repeating….yes I am repeating….:)
Comment 46, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
well come on im waiting ………
Comment 47, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
im waiting for my episode spoilers….???
Comment 48, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Am i the only person from england on here…..?
Comment 49, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
hello ?Is anyone there… im off to bed then.
Comment 50, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer, I have also been saying the same things (in regards to the past remembering). That they could not have possibly remembered the first time around because he HAD NOT happened yet. Look forward to your posts on tonights episode.
Comment 51, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
Coolio duke, thanks.
Comment 52, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I am still hoping Danielle and them run into Sawyer’s group and then we will know that this DID happen before. I am probably wrong though. 13 more minutes on my end! Yay!!!
Oh and about time on and off island. When Ben left the island he appeared in the desert 9 months( something like that) later so I think that only a couple of days on island will be 3 years off. IMO.
Comment 53, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
That french scene with no subtitles drives me crazy. I wonder if Juliet had any half brothers she doesn’t know about ( Sawyer ? )
Comment 54, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
…4 minutes…
Comment 55, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Looks like no TD for the French folks, but I don’t remember anyone thinking Smokey made them ’sick’.
Comment 56, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
No nose bleeds either.
Comment 57, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
I wonder what happened in that hole?
Comment 58, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
The name on a boat in the background is “Illusion”.
Comment 59, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
The skipping is getting more frequent and more violent.
Comment 60, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
There goes the nose bleeds!
You speak Korean? That was funny.
Man WHAT DID SHE SAY TO JIN????
Comment 61, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Well, it looks like neither length of time on the island nor constants are an issue since Sawyer has the nose bleed.
Comment 62, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Here come the Dharma Days
Comment 63, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
OK, I’ll say it…. Is Charlotte ANNIE????
Comment 64, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Was the temple the same as the orchid? I missed that.
Comment 65, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
WHo else will dan meet when he meets young charlote
Comment 66, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
So are the oceanic 6 supposed to go back or not go back?????? Whoa this is way too much to take in…..even with the 30 minutes worth of commercials!!!
Comment 67, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
I don’t think she’s old enough, but it seems possible.
Comment 68, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
So the timetravelers can’t remember, but the people who met them can.
Comment 69, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
I would say, she would have been Annie’s daughter. I really didn’t see any of this coming:(
Comment 70, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Okay, I see more course correction here. Dan told young Charlotte to never come back or you’ll die. She spent her whole life coming back so she could die on the island. She was ’supposed’ to die in the purge. So that’s how he’s learned that you ‘can’ change the past/future, but it won’t matter because it will get fixed.
Comment 71, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hello whisperer (Christian).
Comment 72, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Locke keeps getting screwd
Comment 73, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
So Ben did it wrong and left the wheel loose?
Comment 74, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Ben killed John Locke
Comment 75, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Look on bens face when Desmond said he there for fariday mother was great
Comment 76, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
michael wrote:
when did listening to him get you anywhere worth a damn? haha good line
Comment 77, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Or MAYBE it was future Dan warning her!
Comment 78, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
I wonder if it will turn out that John did it wrong too – Christian told him to push the wheel, and he pulled it. Small detail, but he seems to get a lot of things just a little wrong.
Comment 79, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Hammer wrote:
CS said Locke was supposed to move the wheel. I think he meant originally.
Comment 80, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
That’s what it looked like. It was off axis or something. But was Ben not supposed to move it? Did that mess anything up?
Comment 81, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Where I’m confused is that it seemed that Christian was saying Ben is NOT on Locke’s side, but then again, it still seems like Christian was getting Locke to do what Ben wants him to do. WTF?
Comment 82, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
+++++++
Maybe, but Christian supervised and talked to him just as he was ‘leaving’. I think he did it correct and the Losties will stop skipping….for awhile.
Comment 83, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
There always has been a great deal of manipulation going on. It seems though that if they are taking orders from Jacob, they should be listening to Jacob then, and not each other for orders. Listening to Ben instead just got him in trouble.
Comment 84, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
SO let me get this strait….Ben wasn’t supposed to turn the wheel in the first place, Locke was, RIGHT? Soooo how would that have changed anything?
Comment 85, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
* * * * * * * * * * * * *
I think that is very likely! We saw Dan back in the 70’s, he was probably TRYING to change the future by telling young Charlotte not to go to the island!
: ) P
Comment 86, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jason wrote:
—–
God, NO! Let’s hope not. I’m sure there are enough sharks swimming around the island already.
Plus, I doubt he’s a good a swimmer as Jin…and Jin barely made it….and Michael was below decks anyway. Impossible. Besides, there’s already too many dead people coming back to life; if we are going to get more resurrections let it be some interesting characters like Patchy. Note to Charlie; Please STAY dead.
Comment 87, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Ok….so, Danielle’s people had gone nuts. Her man tried to shoot her and the gun didn’t go off, so she wasn’t meant to die yet. I don’t remember anyone getting that crazy when they were sick. What did the monster do to them? That seemed new to me. Reminded me of when Eko saw his brother or something. I just don’t remember people acting possessed. Was that Smokey’s home down there? Did someone release him to the group?
Comment 88, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
When Christian was talking to John Locke, he said “you came to my cabin” so is that to say that Christian is Jacob?
Sounded like it to me…
Comment 89, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Msmoliss wrote:
Yeah…sounded like he said, “You came to see ME.” This is why I am so confused. Is he Jacob? Is Dan Jacob? I mean how does Dan’s mom know so much anyway?
Comment 90, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Okay Tasha, when Smokey pulled the Yemi trick, it was actually Smokey. But the French folks were still human as she was able to kill them. So I’m guessing that whatever happened in the Temple was different than anything we’ve seen before.
Side note, now we know how Danielle knew that Smokey was a security system…her new and improved possessed hubby was ‘educated’ while in the hole and told her.
Comment 91, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Well I guess Locke DID have to turn the FDW to move and get off the island. This was not a typical LOST episode in the way the story was told, but since we learned a lot, I am reconciling that. I loved the scene when Sawyer and Jin first saw each other!
Favorite line:
He’s Korean, I’m from Encino.
LOL.
: ) P
Comment 92, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
So it wasn’t smokey that made them sick?
Comment 93, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Okay. Seems to me that we have a BOTH/AND situation here:
Yes, Ben almost certainly has ulterior motives for getting them all back on the island
AND It’s likely that they *must* indeed all come back to the island in order to stop the time travel shifts.
In other words, it’s gonna be bad, but they’ve got to do it anyway. Isn’t that just the way it is? :)
Comment 94, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
It might have been, or it might have been what they saw or encountered while they were under the temple.
: ) P
Comment 95, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
That was good PJ. I liked the “kling-on” reference by Charlotte followed quickly by Daniel with “Imperial”.
Comment 96, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
+++++++++++++
Well unless Jacob is a lier, Christian told Locke that he wasn’t Jacob in the cabin. So I’m still thinking that Christian is part of the Canton Rainier club and Locke will be one too!!
Comment 97, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Msmoliss wrote:
Yeah…sounded like he said, “You came to see ME.” This is why I am so confused. Is he Jacob? Is Dan Jacob? I mean how does Dan’s mom know so much anyway?
Hammer wrote:
lost4ever wrote:
+++++++
So did he really act possessed or was it just me? What the heck is smokey guarding? I thought that was the orchid station at first but not so sure……
Comment 98, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Laura wrote:
I am not sure but I think Locke stopped the time travel shifts by turning the wheel, at least I hope so. Yes, it is good that they can answer some of the questions using this story-telling method, but it is growing tiresome, JMO. UNLESS there is a reason for the time they are traveling to besides answering the questions from the first 4 seasons. Something deeper.
Comment 99, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Sorry about comment 97…I have no idea what I did.
I was quoting down starting at lost4ever.
Comment 100, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
what is going on!!??? was anyone else sad that Charlotte died??
Comment 101, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Laura wrote:
+++++++++++=
For now Laura, I’m gonna stick with Locke ‘fixed’ the wheel and they won’t be skipping around randomly anymore. I no longer think that coming back to the island stops the skipping. They have to come back because it’s a course correction.
Comment 102, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
cowpoke wrote:
I was as sad at Charlotte’s death as I was Charlie’s. Sorry PJ.
Comment 103, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
cowpoke wrote:
I have been expecting Charlotte not to make it since the first nosebleed. Plus, she’s never been a sympathetic character which, in my opinion, made her more expendable. I would have liked to have seen her character developed a bit more, but no, I am not sad.
: ) P
Comment 104, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
I posted in comment 64 Tasha, I didn’t catch it but I thought the temple looked an awful lot like the orchid. Was smokey built by Dharma to protect the wheel? Does the wheel make you crazy?
Comment 105, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
+++++++++++++
I heard somewhere before that the wheel is used to ‘hide’ the island…like a security system. The story telling method is a ’side effect’ and I want to believe that the skipping will stop for now, giving us a break from that method. But I think that they will be ’stuck’ in a past time in order to give us more answers.
Comment 106, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Does Daniel’s mother freak anyone else out? She totally freaks me out…she reminds me of some dark magic, satan worshipper..
Comment 107, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
i do agree that they should have developed charlotte a bit more, esp when she was in egypt and found the dharma artifact (i think that was left behind by Ben) right?! was anyone else surprised at Ben’s outburst in the van?!
Comment 108, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Dharma Days
Comment 109, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
+++++++++++++
I didn’t get that at all. The temple looked like the place where Ben ‘unleashed’ Smokey on Keamy’s group. I think Smokey is ancient, and DHARMA didn’t make him, but needed to build a sonic fence to keep him away. I also don’t think the wheel makes you crazy per Ben and Locke using it.
Comment 110, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LostieCreeped out wrote:
Just like Ellie from the 1954 storyline.
Comment 111, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Is anyone wondering who Charlotte’s dad is? Why didn’t he go with her mom and her? I thught she was gonna say….she remembered who her dad was…and it was Ben! But no. No such luck!
Comment 112, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Is anyone wondering who Charlotte’s dad is? Why didn’t he go with her mom and her? I thought she was gonna say….she remembered who her dad was…and it was Ben! But no. No such luck!
Oh yeah, and we know why Danielle didn’t get sick.
Comment 113, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
i don’t think we have seen the last of charlotte, nor have we seen the last of her story….i think there is so much missing there… and they never said who those people were in the boats/canoes……
Comment 114, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
+++++++++++++
I think yer right.
Comment 115, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
You maybe right, but at a quick glance, the temple in 1988 looked very similar to the same place our time-traveling LOSTies arrived to, the orchid.
Comment 116, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
yeah, i’ll go ahead and say it…charlotte is ben and annie’s daughter…
Comment 117, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
I don’t think Ben is old ebough to be Charlotte’s dad.
Did Charlotte say she was born on the island?
Comment 118, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LINS wrote:
Thank you. But seriously, wouldn’t she remember that? I swear when she said “This place is death,” her eyes could have been Ben’s!
Comment 119, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
So how does dan know charlotte in the first place? I mean he went back in time to tell her not to come back to the island was he on the island when he was younger to?
Comment 120, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
Who was Ellie..is that when Locke was born, 1954? That storyline?
Comment 121, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think it was said by someone before that if you turn the wheel you cant come back to the island, so does that mean ben cant come back or that he couldnt come back alive
Comment 122, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
I did the calculations a couple of weeks ago, and Ben could have had her in his late teen years. But then why steal Alex at about the same time.
Comment 123, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LINS wrote:
Ah ha!
Comment 124, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LostieCreeped out wrote:
In the episode “Jughead”, S5E3, aired 2 weeks ago, she was the one who took Daniel to the bomb, holding him at gunpoint.:)
Comment 125, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Here is a BIG question…..
How come BEN has a whole different story for Charlotte? Wouldn’t he have known she was on the island and grew up there? Dharma initiative wasn’t THAT big! I am so confused.
Comment 126, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Amber wrote:
I am fairly sure it was BEN who said that, and well, I believe we can’t really TRUST Ben to tell the truth, now can we?
: ) P
Comment 127, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Ok so this is why im a little confused with the jacob/christian thing. i mean we seen him live his life off the island as jacks dad and being a doctor, so are we saying that he was there before and had to die to go back to the island, or was he never there and just came back to life when the plane crashed. that sounds kind of confusing my question is did christian have anything to do with the island before the crash any answers
Comment 128, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
+++++++++++
Okay wait, when Charlotte was babbling from her past I think I heard her say “Why can’t Annie go with us?” That would confirm her story that she left the island as a child and wanted Annie to go with her. So how does this add up?
Comment 129, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
Fair enough, I assumed Charlotte was closer to 30 than early 20’s with those credentials. Lostpedia has her being born in 1979, and Ben being born in the early 60’s.
Maybe Ben stole Alex to replace Charlotte leaving the island.
Comment 130, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
and how come christian wouldnt help locke up? that was kind of mean. and he sure wasnt going to turn that wheel now was he
Comment 131, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Amber wrote:
+++++++++++++
Free will….gotta do it himself.
Comment 132, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
A push from DocH got me to relisten to Char’s babbling:
She mentioned chocolate before dinner…anyone remember Apollo bars?
I know more about ancient culture than ???? himself.
Turn it up…I love…?????
Anyone pick up the missing words?
Comment 133, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ok another question if danielle was alive now would the memory of jin pop into hear head when it happened? or would time travelin jin just remember meeting her
Comment 134, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Nice cathc Hammer. I think that would rule out Annie being her mom. How about Charlotte Goodspeed?
Comment 135, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
I think Charlotte said she knew about Cartha than Hannibal himself.
: ) P
Comment 136, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Sorry that should be Carthage.
: ) P
Comment 137, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Okay, now here is something I didn’t know…the ancient city of Carthage is now in… you guess it, Tunisia!
Curiouser and curiouser.
: ) P
Comment 138, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
Did she say Annie or DADDY? I swore she said daddy:( Just want to make sure….
Comment 139, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
**********************
and jeronimo jackson is who she loved
Comment 140, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Amber wrote:
I am going to have to watch the first time Rousseaou meets Jin in the first season or 2.
Does she remember him? Good question, she was isolated for 16 years though. He would not have remembered her because in those episodes because it hadn’t happened to him yet.
Comment 141, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Great episode! It was nice to see Ji, Sun seemed to soften up after hearing Jin was alive.
The question now is whether or not Charlotte will stay dead. There is still a lot more of her story to be told. This episode just brought out more questions about her. WHO IS SHE???
Creepy scene when Smokey pulled Montand (is that his name?) down the hole and his arm was yanked off!!!
Comment 142, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
++++++++++
Okay got it, she said ancient Carthage…I heard at first ancient culture. LOL.
Comment 143, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
+++++++++++++++
Your correct, it’s daddy…blew up that theory!
Comment 144, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha, if you would remember back to Season 1, when Sayid first meets Danielle, he follows her out into the jungle with a gun. Danielle is going to shoot him, so he pulls the trigger first, only his gun is unloaded. She tells him that she did the same thing to Robert. So it’s not that it wasn’t her time when Robert pulled the trigger, it’s that his gun was unloaded.
Oh, and my guess is Charlotte’s dad will be Captain Guyliner. This is probably totally wrong and just my wishful thinking but it would be a nice twist in there.
LostieCreeped out wrote:
Haha. That has to be the best, funniest and truest comment on here.
Comment 145, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
emit wrote:
++++++++++++
Thanks, got it…I have a hard time with the accents when they whisper. LOL
Comment 146, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Is Sun going back to the island WITHOUT Ji? I doubt they’ll be making a pit stop on their way back to the island to pick her up.
….Oh, and Libby says Hi. (Sorry, couldn’t resist)
Comment 147, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Can you imagine what he would do if he found out I married an American?” and “I can’t eat chocolate before dinner” is also what I heard.
Comment 148, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
LOL! I was misinformed.:) But it really didn’t blow up the theory, although now I am definitely liking the Ben being Charlotte’s father over her being a Goodspeed. All the more reason for him to steal Alex.
Comment 149, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Lost Chicka wrote:
++++++++++++
I think that Hawking said they would ‘get started’. There must be a process and they still ALL have to go back. Kate, Hugo, Aaron, Ji will all get collected somehow.
Comment 150, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Lost Chicka wrote:
I CANNOT believe he was going to shoot her and the baby! PSYCHO!!!!
Comment 151, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I’m confused about Faraday telling Charlotte in the past that she should never come back to the island. Why doesn’t he remember going back in time and telling Charlotte, or does he and he’s just not telling her? Does this mean that this isn’t the first time he’s been time-traveling? I don’t know how to apply the encyclopedia analogy to this one? I think that the plane crash and the Losties landing on the island is course correcting something that went off-course a lot earlier.
Also, I dont know if this has been discussed before but I think this episode reveals why Locke had to die.He had to die so that Sun would come to the island. If Locke were alive and Sun were to find him then he would have told her that Jin in dead and then she would have no reason to come to the island.
Comment 152, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
I brought this up in post 132, here’s more, look at the date….
From lostpedia:
The Apollo Bar is one of the many foods that were first found in the Pantry within the Swan station by Kate in “Adrift”. What is unusual about this candy is that it is the only food item that is not branded with the DHARMA Initiative logo in some way (although the boxes have the Swan logo on them). It also is the only DHARMA related food item without a generic name (Dharma Ranch Dressing, Dharma Maccaroni, Dharmallars, etc). Apollo Bars are advertised as being “FULL O’ NUTS” and the bar that Kate picked up had a “Consume By” date of October 23, 2004.
During the Lost Experience, the bar was specifically manufactured, advertised and distributed amongst Lost fans worldwide, tying into the overall arc of the game. A detailed history about the company and its founder was also provided (see Apollo Candy Company).
Comment 153, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LostieCreeped out wrote:
++++
Charlotte creeped me out when she was babbling. She truly looked possessed.
Comment 154, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
++++++
If she is like a dark magic, satan worshipper, then the process would be a ritual. Sorry, had to say that…..
Comment 155, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Ok so we know for sure that the Losties were disappearing right b4 folks eyes, per Danielle’s reaction.
Methinks being down in the Temple with Smokey caused the sickness that made the crew crazy.
Methinks we can put to rest any notion that Ben has altruistic ideas with regard to the 06 and the island. He’s an antagonist period. Accordingly I don’t think one can put any confidence into ANYTHING this man has stated, implied or whatever. Hell he said he needed to take Sun to a person when he had the ring on his person the whole time! So while he did have a lil file on Charlotte, he probably only told half the story.
Ms. Hawkings seemed to be “ok” with not having all the 06(5) with them “we’ll just have to make do?” What happened to “Gawd help us all?”
Methinks Ms. Hawkings is being manipulated by Ben and that’s why she is helping…Desmond hadn’t reached her yet to pass on whatever message Daniel wanted.
I strongly agree that the island will be stuck in the Dharma days pre-purge and they will integrate Dharma, but how will they escape the purge? The thing that casts some doubt on this for me is that the Widmore expulsion has not been explained.
Smokey was at the Temple, not the Orchid.
Comment 156, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
I don’t know..I agree and thought the same thing. Just told him Ben did it wrong and now you’re pulling and not pushing. I agree, it’s a small detail, but are there really any small details when it comes to LOST??
Comment 157, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Bedtime for Bonzo, so here you go:
Put all this in yer brain bucket and shake it around.
Reincarnation – Canton Rainier
Char’s hint about ancient Cathage.
The Little Prince’s asteroid.
Four toed foot in an ancient Egyptian looking shoe.
Egyptian type hieroglyphs.
And of course we all know that aliens built the pyramids. :)
Although I’m not ready to say LOST had anything to do with aliens…..shake it around.
Comment 158, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I noticed the inconsistent time intervals of the flashes. For example, some happended in a quick series while others occur several minutes apart. Is there any correlation to this and the wheel appearing to be so unstable as to move by itself before Locke approached it?
Recall, Ben had a tough time moving it.
Comment 159, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Christian has so far appeared to or with both of his kids (Jack &Claire)…he has appeared to John twice now…could he also be his father? I find it hard to believe that Cooper is really John’s bio. father. Or is Jacob just using Christian’s body right now?
Comment 160, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think Jacob isn’t a physical person/thing, rather a spiritual, almost godlike presence that can take different forms (and for the past few sightings has taken the form of Christian). But I don’t think Christian is physically present on the island, just an illusion (hence why he couldn’t help Locke up).
Speaking of Claire, when are we going to learn about what happened to her? Last we saw, she disappeared and was seen in the cabin with Christian/Jacob… is she dead? Any thoughts?
Comment 161, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
SKE wrote:
+++++
Well, since his body is still missing, I have to believe he isn’t an illusion. I mean how could Locke just dream up a guy that he has never seen before who just happens to look like Christian Shepherd and not to mention, says he IS him?
Comment 162, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
+++++++++++++++
Jeronimo Jackson is a musician (or band). Hurley played the record back when it was his shift in the hatch. He also wore a shirt that had Jeronimo jackson in psychadelic 70s font. Sorry, i’m not sure of the exact episode. this confirms that charlotte was definitely on the island before, and part of the Dharma Initiative. please correct me if im wrong.
Comment 163, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
When Ben moved the wheel he ended up in the middle east somewhere in an episode last year. So now Locke moved the wheel and he ends up in LA–but he’s dead, a sacrifice. Interesting. Did Desmond accomplish what he was supposed to do? I don’t think he told Faraday’s mom wha he was supposed too and he definitely wasn’t expecting the island returnees and Ben.
Comment 164, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Just a few comments:
First- what’s up with all of John’s leg injuries? He has had 2 or 3 major injuries on the island itself let alone being paralyzed off the island.
Second, if Charlotte is the daughter of Annie and Ben, I’m wondering if Ben has helped nudge Char back to the island through various means such as “planting” a Dharma artifact in the desert. Also, could Ben have ulterior motives in getting Daniel and Miles back to the island as well? he seemed pretty darned surprised when Desmond showed up and said that Farrady told him to come see Eloise. Is he aware who Farrady is? and his relationship to Eloise?
Comment 165, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Oops, one more thing…I’m having a hard time catching up and reading all these comments because of the whole west coast thing, so maybe this has been said already, but what if Charlotte’s father is Widmore?
Comment 166, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I don’t know about you guys, but I’ve always thought that Captain Eyeliner looks like an ancient Egyptian. When I saw the heiroglyphics on the temple I immediately thought of Alpert.
Comment 167, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
in response to: “Sorry, i’m not sure of the exact episode. this confirms that charlotte was definitely on the island before, and part of the Dharma Initiative. please correct me if im wrong.”
++++++++++++++++++
I am sure this has been discussed before- i’m just now checking out this blog this year-sorry in advance. i am sure Charlotte was the baby in the season 5 opener, “Because you Left” with Dr. Chang. So, doubtful Ben is her biological father. I’m not sure how old Ben was at that time-braindead. Maybe Charles Widmore is her father-I think someone else mentioned this. But why did Dr. Chang and his wife have her? has this been answered on previous blogs???
Comment 168, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think Faraday starts controlling his time travel at some point after the current timeline. He goes back to Dharma days and convinces Charlotte’s mom that she needs to leave with her daughter and tells Charlotte never to come back in an attempt to avoid her death. He doesn’t remember it because he hasn’t done it yet in his “real” timeline. Not sure if that fits the “rules” about time travel others have constructed here, but it makes sense to me =)
Comment 169, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
pandakim wrote:
i think we’ve come to the conclusion that its is Miles not Charlotte in the opener with Marvin Candle, Charlottes dad I think will be either Widmore, Alpert or Ben, good posts everyone, I too hope that the flashes will have stopped for now and the reason the O6 are going back isn’t to stop the time flashes, that has never seemed very substantial to me. Anyone else thinking that it is possible some of the island losties may run into Henry Gale at some point? we can only hope
Comment 170, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
My question is are the remaining Losties on the island frozen in the time slot they are at when Locke puts the FDW back on it’s axis? Was there a flash when Locke moved the FDW, alluding to the fact that the correct timeline has been re-established?
I was a fan of Charlotte’s. If she is really dead, I will miss her. She looked out for herself but never brought harm to anyone else. I would have trusted her had I been a Lostie.
Comment 171, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yes?
Comment 172, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
deangoodes wrote:
+++++++++++
I don’t think the ‘correct’ timeline was established. Like mentioned earlier, I think the skipping was stopped, but they will be stuck ‘when ever’ they are when Locke ‘fixed’ the wheel.
Comment 173, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
WTF wrote:
LOL. You know what I mean by WTF?, right?
Comment 174, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
This is quick but a) great post and b) re: “based on Jin’s chance meeting with Rousseau last week, we see that she is already pregnant when arriving at the Island – so that begs the question of whether/when she and Ben previously met.” – Ben is NOT the father of Alex. Robert was the father… remember, the Others stole Rousseau’s baby and Ben raised Alex as his own. He’s not the Dad, just like Kate is not really Aaron’s mother.
Comment 175, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Look, when the Frenchies went in the hole, they were not made “sick”, but rather enlightened. Once enlightened, they knew secrets about the island, like the fact that smokey is a security system. To Danielle, they seemed sick or Other-like, which freaked her out so she started shooting them. Robert was trying to shoot her in self defense.
Comment 176, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Newbie wrote:
Well my newest thought does put a kink in the encyclopedia analogy, but here it is…
At some point, there will be a jump (either a flash, or purposefully) that will take Daniel (and perhaps the other) to the 70’s – the DHARMA days. We’ve already seen that Daniel was there (but in the mixed up time of the storytelling of LOST, we don’t know where in the chronology of the storytelling, he actually went there).
So I think we will see this jump, which “to us” will happen AFTER Charlotte dies. We will see Faraday IN HIS PRESENT BODY visit little Charlotte and tell her NEVER to come back to the island. He is TRYING to change the future by changing the past. (Clearly, he will have been unsuccessful.)
As I said, the fact that before she died, Charlotte had a memory of an incident that has not yet taken place, throws the encyclopedia and photoshop analogies out the window.
: ) P
Comment 177, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think John stopped the time skips, and sent the James gang to the Dharma 70s/80s era. Now we will see Dan with Chang, Dan telling young Charlotte she must leave, and more information regarding the purge. I’m betting the James gang might have something to do with the purge now.
Comment 178, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Is there anyway that Charlotte isn’t going to really be dead? If you can’t change the past or future then doesn’t that mean she can’t die? That would effect the future. We know she is alive in 2004/2005, so wouldn’t she have to live in present time? Or has thought already been discussed?
Comment 179, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yes, it is what I say at the end of every show. If not out loud, at least in my head.
Comment 180, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
++++++++++++
Struggling with that. That would have Dan attempting to REALLY change the past/future which he alreay knows will get course corrected if he did.
I think she was having a memory of something that DID already happen. And her ending up on the island WAS the course correction because she should have died in the purge.
Comment 181, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Regarding the Remaining LOSTies being stuck in whatever time they were in, I agree that is likely. However, was there another flash when Locke turned the FDW?
They were at the Orchid, *flash* Orchid is gone and only a well (so they went BACK in time), *flash* the well is gone (so they went a LOT FURTHER back in time). So unless there was another flash when Locke turned the FDW, they should be stuck back in a time long before the DI arrived.
: ) P
Comment 182, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
++++++++++++++++++
Sort of, we discussed this scenario to explain how Frogurt died ‘in the past’. Because the time tavel JUST happened, it didn’t ‘always’ happen.
Comment 183, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
+++++++++
Of course, I don’t think logic follows when love is involved. He wouldn’t care if it’s not following the rules and he isn’t supposed to do it, he just would.
Also, does anyone else think that Charlotte could be Annie? If they are back in the 70s couldn’t Daniel have told Charlotte and her mom to get off the island and how to (the well – which is why Charlotte knew about the well) and then, the construction began on the orchid after that (which is where we see Daniel in ep 1). When Char/Annie and her mom travelled through time, they ended up in the future (which is why Charlotte is in her late 20s rather than Ben’s age)? It would also explain her love of 70s music….
Comment 184, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
++++++++++++++
My GUESS would be that yes, there was a flash when Locke turned the wheel. Likley the one that puts them in the DHARMA era that we have guessed at. It looked to me like there was a flash just like Ben’s, maybe a different color?
Comment 185, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I don’t think Ben is Charlottes father based on how he reacted when she came to the island? Didn’t he try to shoot her?
Comment 186, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
Obviously he dosnt die ON the island, he talked to Jack and some of the others before he died
Comment 187, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
So we all figured out I hope that faradays mother; elouse is Ellie from the 1950s and I bet whitmore is his father
Comment 188, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Craig wrote:
+++++++++++++
Hopefully next week we find out if you always go to Tunisia when you turn the wheel.
Comment 189, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Mia wrote:
Yes. He also didn’t know her like he thought he did.
Comment 190, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
katiela wrote:
The reason Will brought up the issue of Ben being Alex’s father is because that possibility has been discussed here frequently over the last few years. But as you stated, this episode seems to bring that issue to a resolution (or, as close to a resolution as you can get with Lost!)
Comment 191, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Faraday IS Jacob perhaps? Why is he not effected by the time switches, like Locke?
Comment 192, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Did Charlotte say that she lived on the island and was part of Dharma? Maybe she was one of the others…could explain why she knew about the well.
Comment 193, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Am I missing something critical (i didn’t see other comments about this ) but didn’t CS say to John while he was turning the wheel ’say hello to my son’ to which John said ‘who’s your son?’
Comment 194, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I’ve decided that I’m giving up on the constants just yet. I think Sawyer had the nose bleed because even though he ’saw’ Kate, he didn’t interact with her. Des grounded himself by interacting with Penny. Locke interacted with several folks. Jin interacted with Danielle. Dan interacted with Des (and we know from Dan’s notebook that Des is his constatnt). But Juliette, Miles, Char, Sawyer didn’t.
Comment 195, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Frank wrote:
You are correct, that happened. I don’t think CS ever told Locke in their only two meetings that he was Jack’s dad, in fact, I don’t think he even said his last name….just Christian.
Comment 196, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Yes, and if Christian is not really “Christian” and it his only his body being used, then why would he say “say hello to my son” ? Leads me to think that it is really Christian Shepard (but he still could be dead or half-dead).
Comment 197, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Mia wrote:
Canton Rainier(reincarnation)….reincarnated?
Comment 198, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I’m not quite following the comments about “the temple”. (e.g Hammer in #109, RGS in #155) People seem to be saying that the area around Smokey’s hole is the temple – is that correct? Do we know for certain this is the case? I just thought the hole was Smokey’s home. I know Robert said something about the security system for the temple, but I didn’t take that to mean Smokey’s hole is the temple. I thought the temple could be elsewhere on the island.
And regarding smokey and hole – did Montand ever come out of the hole? We saw two dead bodies on the beach, and then Robert got killed. But all those guys went down into the hole, yet somehow they came back? Without Montand? So what exactly happened to Montand?
Comment 199, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I thought that John was to “Move” the island. Do you think the island will disappear again?
Comment 200, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Toeknee wrote:
Robert called it a temple, which is leading to the speculation.
Comment 201, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Stacy wrote:
I’m still sticking with Charles Widmore as Ellie’s brother.
Comment 202, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
katiela wrote:
I agree that it is LIKELY that Robert is Alex’s father, but I also don’t believe that we can definitively rule ANYTHING out (without a DNA test! LOL). Just because Robert THINKS he is the baby’s father doesn’t MAKE him the baby’s father! It’s D&C were talking about here, nothing paternal is SIMPLE! LOL.
: ) P
Comment 203, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Toeknee wrote:
++++++++++
Well we don’t know for sure. But I tried to put things together. Remember the passage way that Ben used to summon Smokey to attack Keamy’s group? It seemed to resemble the Temple. So assuming that Smokey hangs out in a tunnel system and the system has an entrance by that ‘building’ I am guessing that the ’security system’ for the Temple would be very close to the Temple. And Robert told that to us in so many words. No?
Comment 204, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Did anyone catch the homage to Austin Powers when after the french dude is pulled down into the temple by smokey, and his arm is torn off, he’s saying I’m down here but I’m ok. I know it was the “system” luring the others down but still.
Comment 205, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
marco wrote:
++++++++++
Oh, that’s funny! “It’s starting to smell like Almonds.” LOL.
Comment 206, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Mia wrote:
We also, possibly purposefully, never HEARD Christian’s answer to his son’s name. For all we know, he didn’t really MEAN Jack. It wouldn’t be the first time that a flash had prevented the character, and indeed the audience, from learning the TRUTH.
Which leads me to… we are supposed to believe that Eloise Hawking is Daniel’s mother. I think it is likely, but I also feel like it could be another trick. Purely from the character development, English accents and timing, I think it is more likely that Mrs. Hawking is Charlotte’s mother. I like butcher-shop Jill as Daniel’s mother.
: ) P
who has just ratcheted up the conjecture to a new level!
Comment 207, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think Kate, Danielle, and Alex all had a striking resemblance even when they are all dirty in the jungle!
So I have read a lot of theories on Charles being Ellie/Hawkings wife/brother/whatelse? Anyhow, if she is related or married to Charles, why is she working against him with Ben? Charles knows exactly where she is, so why can’t he just ASK her where the island is since they are friends/ ex-friends/ ex spouses/ family members. Seems to me that all of this is really twisted and can go in many directions at this point. I am really confused on who is calling the shots, who is in charge, and who is at war with who. I know that this is all being talked about, but I feel like there is something really big missing that is throwing all the theories way off.
In conclusion, I am starting to wonder if all the O6 have a connection to this island. We have kids being adopted all over the place. Where did James parents get so much money for Locke’s dad to embezzle? Who sacrificed their lives to get the plane to crash on the island? Could Shepherd have killed…or should i say SACRIFICED…. himself in Australia to make sure that Jack ended up on that plane? Pay Claire’s psychic to make sure Claire ended up there as well? Be in cahoots with the guy that got Sawyer to go to Australia in the first place?
Last on my thoughts juggling around my head. Was Charlotte’s mom lying to her to PROTECT her or did she not remember the island? I am thinking that everyone including parents were brainwashed to forget. Why would she tell her daughter, “Oh! Everything you remember about your childhood was a dream! It never happened!” As a mother I don’t see myself lying to my 8 year old and who knows how old Charlotte was, unless her mother truly believed that it never happened either.
I know my post sounds confusing but I think I need it to be Wed night again already because i can’t handle this!!!!
Comment 208, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
-How about the rope that Sawyer was holding still being in the ground after the time change. I think that confirms our theory that whatever they are in contact with at the time of the switch goes with them.
-Ji Yeon is with Sun’s mother – she is adorable!
-What was charlotte yelling to Jin in Korean? She definitely looked possessed!
Comment 209, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
Did you see the puzzled look on Ben’s face when Desmond said “Faraday’s mother”?
Comment 210, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
The reason Locke’s leg(s) were broken is that you have to be injured to turn the wheel. Remember that Ben was injured (shot). Coincidence?
Comment 211, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Does Charlotte’s body keep traveling through time even though she is now dead? Let’s hear it Hammer (whisperer)
Comment 212, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
One thing i havent seen anyone mention. Did Jin know Charlotte spoke Korean? Seemed like after Miles said he was from Encino Jin still persisted with the translating until Charlotte gave in.
Comment 213, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
SDlost wrote:
Possessed? Maybe, but she was traveling through different stages of her life the same way Minkowski did.
Comment 214, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
____________________________
I know Robert mentioned the temple, and I can understand the the thought that the security system should be close to the temple, and I can see putting one and one together and getting two (i.e., smokey’s hole is at the temple). But I wasn’t sure if there was something more definitive stated in this episode.
I don’t recall all the details of when Ben summoned Smokey to get Keamy – I’ll have to re-watch that scene.
Comment 215, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Peet wrote:
_______________________________________
Jin and Sun both knew that Charlotte spoke Korean. I don’t remember what season or episode but Jin had seen that Charlotte understood their conversation in Korean and told Sun.
Comment 216, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
*****************************************************
She took out the firing pin on purpose just in case it came to a confrontation with him. It wasn’t that she wasn’t meant to die.
Hammer wrote:
***************************************************
Hopefully not, he tried to kill her when she first came to the island. She survived due to the bullet proof vest she was wearing.
RGS wrote:
****************************************************
Thats what i was thinking. Why after the season long of “They ALL have to go back” was she so damn calm with it just being a few of them?
And I strongly agree as well that we are going to the Dharma Days pre-purge. They are going to see and interact w/ young Ben, Annie, Charlotte, and possible Miles. Chang will be there, Ben’s dad, the Goodspeeds. Excellent!!!
theworstspy wrote:
***************************************************
Here is an article i was reading recently that says Faraday is the reason for four toed statue and that he possible assumes the identity of Jacob….not sure what i think yet though
http://www.docarzt.com/lost/lost-theories/lost-theory-the-four-toed-statue-solved/
Could it be possible that Daniel was born on the Island as well?
Hammer wrote:
******************************************************
Bens “secret room” in the barracks house was the entrance to where he released Smokey. Could someone find this “control room” and deactivate it? Could that barracks house have been built on top of this MUCH older structure on purpose? Is it possible that below the entire island is The Temple or the location where the ancient civilization once lived?
One last thought…..I’m guessing that Locke kept his promise to Jin. when he and Ben met up off island Locke told Ben that Jin was dead and showed him the ring as proof. Once Locke died, maybe Ben took the ring and used it to argue the opposite point. Maybe Ben has no idea either way if Jin is in fact alive or dead
Comment 217, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
SDlost wrote:
It was last season in Something nice Back Home…Jack’s episode where he got sick. Sun and Jin went to get the medical supplies with Charlotte and Dan. Jin realized she spoke Korean and confronted her about it but she lied. Then she caved in when Jin threatened Dan. He told her to make sure when the helicopter came to make sure Sun was on it. Nobody else knew she spoke Korean.
Comment 218, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
I don’t think that is necessarily true. It would be far more dangerous to have a little kid going around talking about mysterious islands, especially since people had been killed there.
Comment 219, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
When Charlotte said and old Daniel told her not to go back to the island she was having a memory similar in nature to what happened to Desmond when Daniel spoke with him at the hatch.
An old Daniel goes back in time to when a young Charlotte was on the island and tells her not to go back because he knows she will die.
This is also why Daniel doesn’t remember.. because he has yet to do this.
Hope that makes sense
Comment 220, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
I know…JMO. There comes a time where a child changes over to an adult. Her mother could have explained itto her. She already was having memories and wanted to go back. Her father must have never been talked about to her either because if none of it was real than her father wouldn’t have been either. I just don’t see why her mom would lie to her her whole life. Especially if she knew she was searching for this place. I could understand lying to a baby but telling an older child that remembers is setting them up to be CRAZY. She said she was raised on the island so she was there for a bit. You can’t just deny a person or child their memories. Anyhow, it’s just bothering me…..
Comment 221, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Bananahands wrote:
itll be interesting to see what happens now that Daniel knows that he tells Char about not coming back to the island when he knows she will. Is he going to do the same thing even if he knows it doesnt work or will he try to find another way to keep Char from the island.
Comment 222, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
I didn’t see this followed upon, but maybe you already figured this out. I don’t think it was Ben who left it loose. It appears that the date that Locke turns the wheel is before the Orchid station was built, and therefore before Ben turned the wheel.
Comment 223, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
The structure next to smokeys hole did not look like anything shown before. I think we can conclude it was the temple. There’s no other explaination for Robert referenceing it.
Comment 224, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
sector7 wrote:
I can go along with that. I guess I was expecting a more signficant structure, and a more dramatic, explicit reveal like we’ve had with most of the other structures on the island.
Comment 225, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
In the episode Jughead Daniel told Richard he loved Charlotte but (as far as I can remember) they never embraced or showed love like lovers. I think he loves her because their related not because he’s in love with her. Charlotte even questioned why Daniel said that & he said because it’s true.
Comment 226, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
A couple thoughts about the FDW:
It wasn’t frozen when Locke got down there, it became frozen after he turned it.
When Locke turns the wheel, shouldn’t the island move again?
Not sure if there’s any significance to these, I just thought I’d throw them out there.
Comment 227, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Laura wrote:
From watching last nights episode, I was under the impression that they were skipping because the wheel was off it’s axis. I think that is rather obvious. What we don’t know now that Locke put it back is WHEN did it stop? I believe that it stopped in the past somewhere and the people coming back will arrive at a different place in the island’s history than when they left. I believe sometime when Ben was a little boy and his dad worked for Dharma.
Comment 228, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJ, I’m with you on the fact (and many others)that I still don’t fully buy into belief that Eloise is Daniel’s mother. And yes, Christian never said who is son was! Could be talking about Jack – could be talking about someone else?
Comment 229, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
RE: comments 103 and 107 about Charlotte’s development…
D&C have said that the backstories of the “freighter tots”, as some here referred to them, were suupposed to have been more significant parts of season 4, but the writers’ strike changed that. So for Charlotte they apparently had to cram all her information into a 2 minute deathbed scene.
Comment 230, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
_____________________
I’m not quite ready to give up my photoshop idea entirely. While it is true that Charlotte recalled a memory that – as far as we have seen- has not happened yet, she was also in a state where she seemed to be “mind” traveling all over the place. So it could still hold, although it is a little harder to hold on to it.
Comment 231, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Charlotte said she loved Geronimo jackson, a I believe fake band that Hurley made reference to in season 2. He said something to charlie about going to the hatch they’ve got geronimo jackson record down there or something.
Comment 232, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
In Jin’s scenes with Rousseau, I was expecting Jin to tell Rousseau about “the Others” on the island. Then that would have brought up the question, who came up with the term “the Others”? Rousseau used that term with Sayid, then Sayid used it with Jin and the rest of the Losties, then Jin mentions it to Rousseau, etc. Sort of like Alpert’s compass (or is it Locke’s compass?)
Comment 233, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Toeknee wrote:
+++++++++++++
Well let’s remember that the island is not necessarily traveling in time…it’s the Losties that are skipping. The wheel is loose because it’s loose, not only loose in a certain time that the Losties are in.
Comment 234, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Also, I dont know if this has been discussed before but I think this episode reveals why Locke had to die.He had to die so that Sun would come to the island. If Locke were alive and Sun were to find him then he would have told her that Jin in dead and then she would have no reason to come to the island.
I believe Locke was lying to Jin. Locke believes that they all have to go back but I do not think that is the case.
Comment 235, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Sometimes I think that if the losties had better communication skills then most of these questions would be answered by now. It would have been easier to get the O6 people together if Jack threw some sort of O6 reunion party and asked them all to come, ya know?!?!
I know, it’s just TV…
Comment 236, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I haven’t seen this mentioned here yet. A lot of thoughts posted on earlier episodes suggested that the time travelers cannot change the future through their actions. But on last nights episode, we see Jin convincing Danielle Rousseau not to enter Smokey’s hole with the guys. Had he not been there, she would’ve gone down the hole with the rest of them. Because she did not go down the hole, she ends up shooting all of them. Isn’t this evidence that the time travelers do change the future? Danielle Rousseau in 2004 would not have had the story she told, were it not for Jin keeping her out of Smokey’s hole in 1988.
Comment 237, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
Maybe they went to the future. Just because the ORchid was gone does not mean that they went back in time. Maybe at some point the orchid gets destroyed and at some other point the well gets filled up to protect the wheel from being used again. The 1st episode this season Chang freaked out because his construction guy wanted to blow up the wall with the wheel behind it. He said something about that energy getting out would cause a world of hurt.
Comment 238, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
dadmandrama, maybe Danielle Rousseau woudn’t have gone down there anyhow (even without Jin being there)? Maybe Robert would of talked her into going back up?
Comment 239, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
++++++++++++++
I don’t think Locke lied to Jin. And I still believe that they ALL have to go back and they ALL will.
Comment 240, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
SDlost wrote:
Yeah, but who knows how many would have showed up. Remember Hurley’s birthday bash? Very few made it to that LOL
Comment 241, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Did I miss something obvious? Why was Sayid mad at Jack? I get something happened that he doesn’t trust Ben, but Sayid seemed equally annoyed at Jack in the end of TPID.
Comment 242, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I’m with you Hammer, Locke didn’t lie to Jin because he most likely never talked to Sun. He gave Jin’s ring to Ben who gave it to Sun.
Comment 243, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hurley’s Dad, I think Sayid was mad at Jack because he saw how Jack had no idea that Ben was the one behind trying to take Aaron (possibly a strategy to get Kate to the marina). Sayid was probably wondering why Jack could trust Ben after all his lies….
Comment 244, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hurley’s Dad wrote:
++++++++
Jack support Ben and them all going back, that’s all Sayid needs.
Comment 245, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
sorry if this was mentioned in all the postings ( i don’t think it was) but did anyone notice the hieroglyphics on the “temple?” they looked very much like the hierglyphics when the button was not pushed and “system failure” occurred.
Comment 246, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
The look on Ben’s face was priceless when Desmond showed up and asked if they were here to meet Daniel Faraday’s mother also. It seemed like Ben either didn’t know what he was talking about or was wondering how Desmond knew Ms. Hawkings is Daniel’s mother. If Eloise Hawkings is working with Ben to get them back to the island, how would Charles Widmore know exactly where she is? How is it that Sun goes from talking with Charles Widmore at the airport about wanting to kill Ben, to suddenly saying “oh yeah, I’ll go with you now.” Just seeing Jin’s wedding band doesn’t seem like enough to get Sun to go back. And I don’t know who to believe…. Claire and Charlotte have now both said not to bring people back to the island (Claire = Aaron, Charlotte = Sun). Yet Christian, Ben, and Richard are telling Locke that everyone has to come back to the island.
What if the show ends with everyone travelling back in time before the crash happened and none of them ever get on the plane and none of this stuff ever happens?? I would be disappointed if that happens!
Comment 247, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Great episode. Great theories above. My biggest issue. Have we seen anyone eat anything since the time-jumps started? Time travel must be like “Red Bull” – it gives you wings. That’s why they all have nosebleeds. Ten time jumps (reb bulls) – no food.
Seriously, with Smokey running around eating French food in 1988… had the sonic fence been constructed yet? If that was the true “temple” and it had the ‘cerberus vent’ (Smokey’s doghouse) underneath it – that means that when the Others vacated the barracks… they were headed for what – protection BY Smokey?
Comment 248, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
I think so Doc. I think the Others were at the Temple by the time Ben did the old ‘get ‘em boy’ trick on Keamy.
Comment 249, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Conclusions from last night’s episode:
- Russoeu was telling the truth about how she got on the island and what happened to her crew. She might be wrong about what exactly the “illness” was that led to their death, but overall she was right. I also think we now know- once and for all- that Alex was NOT Ben’s real daughter (it has been stated and shown over and over again by the writers, so let that horse be).
- Ben was never supposed to move/ leave the island, Locke was. (But didn’t Locke say ” he wants YOU to move the island?” after visiting Jacob’s cabin?)
- Ben had no idea that Hawkins is related to Farraday. He also was not expecting Dezmond to show up. I think that means only the O6 are supposed to go back, not EVERYONE that left.
- I don’t think Charlotte is Annie- she and Ben would have recognized/ remembered each other. Also don’t see how she could be their daughter. Annie left when she was just a kid, too young to have left pregnant.
Comment 250, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
dadmandrama wrote:
ANd evidence that it happened BEFORE? Supporting my theory????
Comment 251, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Funny thought….Remember when Vincent found that arm in the jungle and came out with it in his mouth. Was that Montand arm? I think so
Comment 252, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
BaileyLovesLost wrote:
******
What if Charlotte ment for Ji Yeon not to return to the Island? Jin doesn’t know that Sun has had the baby yet nor if it a Girl or Boy.
Comment 253, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
It was also interesting that Eliose Hawking didn’t look surprised to see Desmond with the rest of the O6. Did she expect him? Did she need him there? Ben was surprised he was there but could it be because that was part of his plan and he was surprised it worked out?
Comment 254, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
How do you know she left when she was just a kid?
Comment 255, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
No it was Ben’s dad’s arm. Skelator AKA Roger Workman.
Comment 256, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Quick question: where are the children? We know some survived the crash because Ana Lucia (?) said the others took all the kids. Pregnant women on the island do not live to deliver. Is this just a forgotten story line or am I crazy?
Comment 257, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Just a thought…last week someone here threw out the theory that Locke was “becoming” the islands new Ben. Maybe this was just the start of him lying and manipulating people to get what he wants? I don’t know if I’m sold on this idea, but it’s something to consider.
Comment 258, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
+++++++++++++++++
She said Daddy, “why can’t Daddy come with us?”
Comment 259, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
___________________
I guess I meant more that Annie would be too young to be Charlotte’s mom. Ben was born in the early 60’s and Annie was a couple of years younger than him- born in the mid- to late 60’s. If she was Charlotte’s mom, she would have had her at a very young age (Char was born in 79).
Comment 260, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Has anyone mentioned that Jin found 2 dead Jacks lying next to each other? I could not find any mention on this board of this point yet. Jack must be coming back to the island more than once and ends up getting killed more than once. How does that work!
Comment 261, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Any ideas about why Charlotte knew Korean and why she tried to hide it at first?
Comment 262, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Christian seemed sinister. I think Locke may be in the midst of more manipulation. This is his pattern.
I can’t wait to see what Claire is up to, and what Christian said to her to get her to part with Aaron.
Comment 263, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
I think teenage Locke had a GJ poster in his locker, too.
: ) P
Comment 264, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
dadmandrama wrote:
I don’t think there was any changing of the future. IMHO, there is only one version of events that took place in 1988, and those events always involved a time-travelling Jin arriving on the island and stopping Rousseau from going down the hole.
Comment 265, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I have a few things i need some help answering here…first off is if older Danielle Rousseau has met Jin before in previous seasons…why then didnt she flip out..cause it hasn’t happened yet? but kinda has…like desmond and Faradays interaction?…..the thing that gets me with these loop theries is that although when Jin and Older Rousseau met it hadn’t happend yet…but it did..it was in the past..her crew was dead..and those accounts must have happened…right?
and secondly where in the world did walt go? wasnt he like the Gifted kid that made birds fly into a window and was creepin all over the Island showin up as apparitions and stuff where does he tie in with anything now…and who is Christian..i know hes jack and claire’s dad (and possibly) someone elses…but..who is this guy…what makes this alcoholic doctor so connected with this magical island….come on hammer…i need answers
Comment 266, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I just starting watching Lost a week ago and I am sooooo HOOKED!!! It’s the best show in the world! But that Ben…ooooo he bugs me. So cryptic and full of lies this guy is.
Really, can he be trusted? Poor Sun, Jack and Aaron’s “New Mom”. They may have stepped in something really awful this week.
Please tell me everything about this Ben character. He even LOOKS shady to me.
Comment 267, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Time to throw down the Gauntlet…reputation on the line…simple question with less than two seasons remaining:
Is Ben really “one of the good guys?”
Yes or No?
Rita? PJ? Hammer? Miraks? Others? Go on record with a call.
Comment 268, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
shah wrote:
WHoa! Glad you are hooked now!! There is no way to explain Ben. You should go watch it from the VERY beginning. ABC.com has free episodes! Good Luck!
Comment 269, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
perrier wrote:
+++++++++++++++++
Those weren’t two Jacks those were the French crew.
Comment 270, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
perrier wrote:
*******************************
Those weren’t dead Jacks, those were dead French guys from her crew.
Comment 271, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Stacy wrote:
We did not learn that Ellie form the 1950’s is Ms. Hawking. We also did not learn for sure that Ms. Hawking is Dan’s mother, although that is probably the case. But I am not so sure that Ellie from the 50’s is that same woman just yet.
Comment 272, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
dadmandrama wrote:
************************88
That’s because everything that is happening in the past has already happened that way before. They’re not changing anything, they’re doing the things that need to be done to make the future (or present) the way it is. The only exception in Desmond. This is “The Time Traveler’s Wife” theory of time travel, not “Back to the Future” time travel theory.
Comment 273, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
I pick up your gauntlet and slap you across the face with it! LOL
Truth is that one of the underlying themes of LOST is how gray “good” and “bad” really are. Kate, Sawyer, Jin, Sun, Sayid, Locke, even Hurley – they have all done some really BAD stuff. Yet, by the most part we consider them good guys. They are our collective protagonist.
So then we get to Ben. We haven’t fully uncovered his motives. We cannot trust a thing he says. But is he any “worse” than any of our “good” guys? He is highly manipulative, he’s killed, clearly he is excellent at fabricating stories. But does any of this make him “bad” really? Not compared with any of the others.
So then we look at the characters’ self-assessments. Each of them, I think, felt they only did what they HAD to do – even if other people do not agree. Are Ben’s “evil” actions done for any reason OTHER than altruistic? We may have to wait for May 2010 to know for sure.
So while I wouldn’t swear to it in a court of law, I will say that I believe that ultimately, Ben is one of the “good” guys.
: ) P
Comment 274, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
i need answers wrote:
++++++++++++++++
I’ve given my opinion on all of these several times….so I’m not sure how I can help.
Comment 275, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
shah wrote:
+++++++++++
Go to lostpedia.com and search for Ben, you’ll get more than you want. :)
Comment 276, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
We don’t have enough info to know. But I believe that Ben believes he is a good guy. He stopped DHARMA from ‘exploiting’ the island.
What about you? Money where you mouth is?
Comment 277, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
I think the constants are somewhat overthought. We only know for sure that Desmond needed a constant and she was in present time. I do not think what Desmond experienced and what the others are experiencing is the same thing. Meaning Sawyer, if in fact constants can stop td, could not have used Kate because he was in the past. Dan’s time travelling rat was based on sending it’s conscious mind travelling not the entire thing. He used radiation to send the rat through time and jughead was a nuke (radiation bomb). There has to be a connection.
Comment 278, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Also, maybe Dan has time travelled before causing him to build up a tolerance to td. We did not even learn the term temporal displacement until this year. Was it the same thing that Desmond and some of the freighter folks experienced?
Comment 279, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
~~~~~~
I will give it a shot
Yes.
Walt is back with his grandmother in the US.
Christian (i think) is the human form that Jacob took so he can talk to people. Jacob assumed his dead body on the island.
How does that sound Hammer?
Comment 280, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
what about rousseau already meeting Jin…and later on (like seasons 1 &2) she doesnt say anything about it….”That’s because everything that is happening in the past has already happened that way before. They’re not changing anything, they’re doing the things that need to be done to make the future (or present) the way it is. The only exception in Desmond. This is “The Time Traveler’s Wife” theory of time travel, not “Back to the Future” time travel theory.”—in this theory would rouseau remember Jin since it already happened?
Comment 281, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
********************************
I’ve been wondering about that, where are the others? Are they jumping around in time as well? I think I remember Ben saying something about them going somewhere, maybe the temple, where they would be safe. Does being in the temple somehow prevent them from being tossed around in time?
Comment 282, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Also, didn’t Ben send his people (Richard et al) to the temple saying that they would “be safe” there when freighter folk were coming.
Comment 283, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
The Wrz wrote:
++++++++++++++
Alright, that’s good, but here’s mine”
Yes, it hasn’t happened yet…not the same as Des/Dan. She doesn’t recogize him because this is the first and only time Jin visited her in the past….no loop.
Walt is at home with g-ma and since Locke visited him, his story is not yet over.
Christian is reincarnated and Locke will be too…Christian is not Jacob. No idea yet his connection to the island.
HTH.
Comment 284, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I wonder if Locke will be back in his wheelchair once he gets off the island?
Also , Daniel seems to have a very deep attachment to Charlotte, and I remember a post at one time wondering if he’s her father and I think that seems a strong possibility.
Comment 285, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think Ben is one of those people with intent to do “good.” I think he feels his actions are justified and necessary to acheive a collective “good.”
After last night’s episode, I’m wondering if Jacob (or Jacob’s contact set–Christian included) is “bad.” Something Ben recognizes. I listened to Christian in the cave with Locke a few times, and the verbal and nonverbal indicated something more than a benevolent leader upset with an underling disobeying an order “I told YOU to move the island John.”
Ben shot Locke after taking him to the cabin to see Jacob. We hear someone (who we assume is Jacob) saying “Help me.” With Ben present it’s reasonable to assume he’s at odds with Jacob. At first I assumed it was a twisted jealousy that led him to shoot John. Now I think it shows that Jacob and Ben are in different camps.
I don’t know Ben’s ultimate motivation, but I think he’s “good.”
Last point–I think Walt is in Ben’s mind the one Jacob promised would come. Jacob/Christian and to an extent Richard have placed their chips with Locke. I think Ben has a different view.
Comment 286, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Is Ben really “one of the good guys”? Yes or No?
I will stick it out there.
A year ago – NO.
Now, and until the final minute of the final episode – YES.
Ben really is one of the good guys. This is how the writers get their jollies. Making us hate the best written character on TV, and then making us have to respect him.
Comment 287, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Laurie wrote:
++++++++++++
That’s a possible explanation. The only thing I am confident of is that the group we saw skipping has been separated from the true Others. They are not skipping together.
Comment 288, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
I think Ben is the good guy- as far as dedication to the island is concerned. He has been manipulative very often, but he is pretty honest about it. He does not get innocent people killed if he can avoid it and has his own “moral code” that he follows. IF the story was told from the viewpoint of the Others and we saw our Losties and their background stories from that point of view, I’m pretty sure THEY would be considered the bad guys.
Comment 289, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
______________________________________
Actually, Dan said it’s probably both. We don’t know for sure. When Ben moved the island, the island could have moved three years into the future right then. Thus, making the time differentiation between on-island and off-island losties in-line with one another.
Comment 290, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
++++++++++++
Okay. Now that you have I will. Yes, Ben is on side of good and not evil….I hope. :)
Your side note about Walt…I disagree, Ben wouldn’t have sent Walt packing if he were the ‘one’. JMO.
Comment 291, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
___________________________________
It bothers me that Sayid walked away. I mean, where’s this guy going to go? From Ben’s assassin to fry guy at Burger King? With the love of his life dead what does he have to go back to anyway? He should just go back to the island because he has nothing better to do. I would.
Comment 292, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
i need answers wrote:
***************************
I agree, she should remember him. Maybe the writers hadn’t worked out all these details back when her character was first introduced. Maybe it can be explained away by saying 16+ years had gone by, she’s traumatized by what’s she’s been through and maybe a little (or a lot) crazy, so she just didn’t recognize him.
Comment 293, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
We will have to agree to disagree. Locke has done whatever necessary to perform what he believes is his destiny. He absolutely would have lied and probably used the ring the same way that Ben does to convince them to go back. I will go on record as saying that not ALL of them have to go back. I”ll guess that Jack, Kate, Hurley, and Ben do return but other than that we will have to wait and see.
Comment 294, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
_________________________________________
Ben is a little whiny baby that wants his mommy back. I believe all his motives are self serving. He doesn’t deserve to be island keeper because he isn’t truly worthy. He can’t hold John’s jock when it comes to being a “good guy”.
Comment 295, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Mia wrote:
I said he would have lied to her to convince her to return because he believes it is their destiny to be on the island. He thinks he is carrying out some great mission and will do/would do whatever necessary to get them to return, even die.
Comment 296, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
We do not know how long the people on the island have skipping. I theorize that they have only been skipping for a day or two.
Comment 297, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Ben is good. Whidmore is bad.
Dharma Initiative is Whidmore’s group. He has used the islands special properties it make himself rich. The Hostiles are there to protect the island and later become the Others, probably with the help of those on the island who go back in time. Kind of sounds Republican vs Democrat, huh? So Ben is the Nancy Pelosi of the show. Whidmore is Dick Cheney.
Jacob is the spirit of the island.and can manifest in dfferent ways: appearances of familiar people, smoke monsters, etc.
Comment 298, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Ben got very Emo this year…hes such a good character…as far as good or bad guy…i liked the comment that the Island totally shows shades of gray to whats good or bad…very true..everyone has shown thier bad sides or done bad things..so i guess if i had to pick…hes a good bad guy and a bad good guy…but i dont think you can call him “good” or “bad” because we dont know his real motives..he did assist in the mass killing of the Dharma…anytime you kill that many people i dont know how “good” you can be
Comment 299, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think John wants to be good. The intent is there. But he has all this backstory info showing how his actions don’t match his intent. He looked like a child recognizing the error of his ways when Christian spoke to him. We’ve seen this from him often. I just think he’s on the wrong side, or that we haven’t seen John Locke looking/acting with an evolved perspective.
Maybe the backstory showing us the transition from Locke to Bentham.
Bentham was one of the small group who forwarded the idea that the moral worth of an action is determined solely by its contribution to overall utility. Doesn’t Ben now best fit a person following this code? John must get on board fully. He must finally end others’ manipulations of his actions for their purposes. He must let go of the knife, and truly act as “one of the good guys.”
I envision a scene between Ben and John where Ben submits to John.
Comment 300, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
~~~~~
I think Ben found locke and somehow got Locke in the coffin(not sure if he killed him or what)after Locke told Ben what he knows. Then Ben used that info to coax the O6 to come back. I imagine Locke showed him the ring to prove that Jin is dead, but if he is dead than Sun will have no reason to go back. Ben knows that he must find reasons for everyone to want to go back. Ben looks out for himself. Locke always has good intentions but they always backfire. I am surprised he didn’t try to blow the wheel up, like he does with everything else important on the island
Comment 301, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Okay, a few things that I’ve been having trouble with (sorry if it’s off topic)Ben seems to know quitea bit about the island and the Losties/O6 relationship to it, but here are my questions:
If he indeed knows they need to stay on the island, why did he let Kate, Sayid and someone else (Hurley?) leave on the helicopter after Alpert shot Keamy last season? Along those same lines, why would he kill Keamy knowing he would also be killing everyone on the tanker? What if some of the people who are “important” to the island are on the tanker?
Comment 302, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Can someone tell me any of the good things Ben has done, that aren’t self serving?
Comment 303, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
…we do not know how long the people on the island have [been] skipping. I theorize that they have only been skipping for a day or two.
I completely concur. In fact, I think the off-islanders have lived their “3 years” while the “time skippers” are merely living the ‘70 hours’ referenced by voodoo math priestess Hawking.
Comment 304, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Regarding the wheel chamber that Locke fell in to… it was interesting how they shot it. It seemed to be a reversal of the chamber that Ben was in – almost a mirror image – as if instead of it being the same chamber, we were looking at what was on the other side of Ben’s donkey wheel. .
Check out Ben’s face when he sees Desmond outside of the church- it’s like a light bulb suddenly goes off in his head. As the one person who can change things, Desmond instantly becomes plan B. Three years of coordination and effort, and Ben’s only 2 for 6. But with Desmond going back to the island, maybe that doesn’t even matter. Ben looks completely astounded to see him. I think this marks the first time Ben even speaks to Desmond. And as he brings him in to see Hawking, Desmond suddenly becomes their ace in the hole.
Remember when Rousseau totally freaked out when she saw Jin again on the beach? ”I saw you disappear!”
In her shock, I saw a simple answer to the time travel noodle-cooker that many of you have been puzzling over since last week, Did the French Lady recognize Jin when she first met the castaways in Season 1? The answer could very well be: Does it matter? For Rousseau, Reappearing Jin was one more scary, inexplicable thing in a scary, inexplicable situation that was about to become a way of life. By the time their lives intersected once more in her future timeline, seeing Jin again (if she even recognized him), the significance probably just bounced off her. ”Oh. You again. Whatever.”
Comment 305, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
that is kind of a cop out to what is more than likely a slip up in the many different elements of this plot..i bet the writers just missed it..they cant be perfect
i love that locke and ben are depicted on mirror images at the Donkey wheel
Comment 306, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
K.C. wrote:
============================================
I see the Smoke Monster more as Dick Cheney.
Comment 307, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Something i just read quoted from Executive Producers Damon Lindelof & Carlton Cuse as they rehash This Place Is Death
* The ‘temple’ seen in ‘This Place is Death’ is “not necessarily THE temple” and isn’t where the smoke monster lives but rather his ‘Camp David’.
Comment 308, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Could Desmond be Charles Widmore’s Father?…his son Charlie…now Des obviously as he so clearly stated he didnt ever want to go back to the Island..(foreshadow) but what if penny and baby charlie go back too..and then somehow are sent to the past and Thats how Widmore got to the Island and became a hostile with richard…could also explain Widmores hatred for Desmond..cause Des never really did anything to be looked down upon so much by widmore….
oh ya….where is Rose? and the dog?
Comment 309, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I agree Charlotte is not Ben’s daughter.
I don’t think Robert was shooting in self defense, BUT I love the “enlightened” theory, is it consistent with Rouseau’s original story? I thought that the sickness was taking place over the course of a few days or weeks. Also if they were enlightened why would they forcibly try to enlighten Danielle (assuming force because she felt the need to carry her rifle) especially if she’s preggo, and may be someone they need.
Encylo. theory is definitely harder to swallow with the Charlotte memory reveal of the Dan warning to her, as he didn’t remember, because it hadn’t ‘happened’ yet. It does however bring me back to that Slaughterhouse 5 theory that Time is that 4th dimension, and everything has already happened.
Re: Constants, if it is true that these constants are needed, shouldn’t they be needed for EVERY time jump? So because you meet up with a constant in one time period, it prevents one’s mind from becoming disoriented again in another period?
I am not sure of what would prevent Ms. Hawkings from working against Widmore, regardless of relationship status…things change. Maybe she realizes Charles is up to no good etc. Maybe she is being manipulated by Ben’s predominately evil arse. (I’m siding with Brother/Sis relationship).
Lol, you guys come up with some incredible theories that are probably more right than wrong, but I am going to go ahead and state anyone thinking Ben is a protagonist in any way, is a fool! He may be the lesser of 2 evils (Widmore and he) but he’s not out to help Jack & co. unless it helps him.
Comment 310, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
mcotter wrote:
OK, I’ll have to go back and find those discussions but the baby in the season 5 opener was clearly white and Charlotte can speak Korean. Which led me to believe she was the baby with Marvin Candle/Dr. Chang/etc. I don’t understand why it is assumed Miles was the baby but I’ll go back and read the posts. thanks.
Comment 311, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
To The WRZ:
To the real Jeremy Bentham, Ben’s actions (if in fact he is working to “save the world”) would be seen as morally good. Killing individuals is not a concern to a being driven by a philosophical code of Utility, or a “greatest good principle.”
So now this is where it gets interesting for me:
Bentham lived and wrote extensively during the Jacobin Terror” He thought the “natural rights” supported by folks like John Locke were compatible only with the “order of chaos.”
More interesting still is that Bentham initially supported the Jacobins. Initially supported Jacob-ins. Jacob-Ben. Then opposed him. Became part of “scared opposition.”
Ben beat him to it. Understood that natural rigts, encouraging mankind to seize hold of something of worth–the island–for individual gain–was morally reprehensible.
Our John Locke morphing into Bentham might mark the point at which Locke truly joins the “good guys.”
For now I’m sorting this way:
Good guys–Ben, Richard, Others
Bad Guys–Jacob, Locke (for now), Dharma, Widmore
Comment 312, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
i need answers wrote:
===========
Ummm how could Penny be Charlie’s daughter and mother?
Comment 313, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
And by fool I do mean it in a playful way, but fool nonetheless, so I am also throwing down a gauntlet of sorts.
Comment 314, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
RGS wrote:
I’m a fool then, I don’t think he as to be helping Jack et al to be a protagonist…he’s working toward what he believes is the ‘greater good’.
Comment 315, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I’ve been trying to rack my brain to remember, but how much interaction did Rousseau and Jin have pre-flash?
Solitary was Sayid
Numbers was Hurley
Exodus’ was Charlie and Sayid
Greatest hits – she blew up the tree and gave her gun…Jin was there for both.
Is it possible she never had the opportunity to recognize him?
Comment 316, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
cowpoke wrote:
yeah, i was bummed about that…i liked the story between her and Faraday and i like that actress a lot…good thing on this show dead doesn’t mena we won’t see them again…;)
Comment 317, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Ummm how could Penny be Charlie’s daughter and mother?
They go to the Island and their kid charlie gets somehow sent into the past..becomes a hostile..hes sex with Elle and gets her prego they have to leave to have the baby (penny) – possibly the one with the korean doctor..she grows up and meets desmond..has a baby..goes to the island and it happens again…no chance?
Comment 318, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
then penny and faraday are bro and sis
Comment 319, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I really like the theory of daniel being charlottes dad it could work. maybe her mom was the lady in the bed. hes been going through time trying out different ways to keep her from coming to the island. but she was suppose to die in the purge. course correction
Comment 320, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Lar wrote:
I’ve thought about this, and the question as to why he let Walt leave. My guess is that he thought that if the island REALLY needed them to stay, that it would prevent them from leaving. Just like when Locke blew up the submarine.
Lar wrote:
In this case, I don’t think Ben WAS thinking. I think he was too caught up in the grief and guilt that he let Alex die. But again, I expect that he also believed that if someone was SUPPOSED to live, the island would make sure that person did (Jin, for example). How many people have we seen survive the unsurvivable?
: ) P
Comment 321, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
RGS wrote:
*********************************************************
When Eloise learns Widmore intends to exploit the island, she turns to his nemesis, Ben, to protect it.
Randon thoughts:
1. When Lock turns the wheel, the chamber/wheel is no longer frozen. Could it be that he reason it was froze in the first place is because, like the C4 on the boat, if it’s unstable and set to go off, the way to stabilize it is to freeze it? When Daniel is seen in the Orchid during Dharma time w/ Chang, he’s carrying what looks like an oxygen tank. But what if it’s actually liquid nitrogen – to freeze the area so he can safely drill through to the wheel?
Drinking water from the well (if it was ever full in the first place) might have caused people like Richard (we don’t have any proof that he’s the only one) to never become old. OR The well was to “vent” the island’s energy. Since this vent was shut, it would build up and the Swan station was responsible for discharging that buildup.
Comment 322, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
There have been moments this season so far that made me really sad or really happy. When Sawyer saw Kate in the jungle, that was one that made me sad. When Sawyer found Jin in the jungle, that was one that made me really happy. Then in last night’s episode I was very sad when Locke was going down the well and the time flash came and Sawyer was trying to pull him. After they came out of the flash and Sawyer realized that the well was just the ground and the rope was sticking out of it, Sawyer was digging away at the ground to get Locke back like a Beagle trying to find his bone. It made me sad :-( Sawyer has really made a 180 degree change from when we first met him in S1.
I don’t think Ben is a good guy. I want to, but there are just too many things that he’s done wrong. Getting lawyers to go after Kate to get blood samples from her and Aaron was so mean. And remember, Jin told Locke to give Sun his wedding band and tell her that he is dead because he doesn’t want her to come back. Don’t you think Locke might have told Ben this when they met? Why would Locke go against his promise to Jin? If Locke did give Ben the wedding band and told him to tell Sun that Jin is dead, then Ben giving it to Sun and using it to get her to go back to the island is so wrong on so many levels!
Ben = bad guy in my books.
Comment 323, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
Okay, that does make sense. I think. ;) Thanks PJ!
Comment 324, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
so originally we think ben is a bad guy, now were kind of thinking he may be a good guy (which i want him to be) but i think the writters are setting it up that way so we start to think he is good. but in the end i think hes going to be a bad guy. I love his character
Comment 325, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I feel like there has got to be some reason that charlotte knows korean, other than her just knowing it.
Comment 326, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Did anyone notice the small red star in the back of Jin’s shirt last night? It was very random, which leads me to think it must mean something. You can see it when he is drinking from that big leaf in the jungle. Thoughts?
Comment 327, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I don’t think Ben is an “evil” person. He definately has done some bad things but they all have a reason behind them. Maybe it’s ultimately to protect all of mankind? And he had to make some human sacrifices along the way (the purge, etc)?
Comment 328, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Scooter wrote:
YES! That would fit the general rules that many on this blog have inferred. Which is just plain torture, isn’t it? He knows now he’s going to talk to her as a child, and warn her, and it won’t stop her from coming back to the island and dying–so, yeah, Daniel will be going a little nuts.
Comment 329, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I just dug up some info that the lost DVD’s have SECRET MENUS? Where have I been? Anyhow, off of one of those there is speculation that Horace and Olivia were part of Geronimo Jackson? Maybe this is why Charlotte loves them? Parents maybe? Anyhow, I am still in shock about this DVD thing. I am like the biggest freak out there about this show so guess I will be on my way to dig up secret menus…LOL
Comment 330, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
~~~~~~~
And Ben is not trying to hold the island for his personal gain??? Ben’s greater good is his own personal gain. He was the leader and had the power. But then Richard(and Jacob) realizes that he does not deserve to be leader(like he probably does with Widmore) and helps Locke to “overthrow” ben. He turns the wheel instead of Locke, because he knew what would happen and that he could possibly come back and be leader again. He shows us how bad Widmore is, so we think that Widmore is evil. However they both want the same thing, control of the island.
Side Note: My favorite part of the episode was when they are trying to explain time travel to Jin. I expected him to have one of those “the office” type moments where he looks at the camera.
Comment 331, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Newbie wrote:
_______________________________________________
Eloise’s face looks like a mix between an alien and a cartoon turtle.
Comment 332, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Amber wrote:
Anthropology is a study of culture and a lot more. To study culture and societies, I would think a good anthropologist would know several languages. Why Korean is one of them, not sure. I would think it would be hard to study a culture without understanding their language. So I would think she must have studied the Korean culture for some reason.
Comment 333, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LizS wrote:
++++++++++++++++++
Well I disagree, but my theory is a little unpopular right now. I think they have hinted around enough that Dan has memory issues. I believe that he has already travelled and told Char to leave. He just doesn’t remember it.(Remember his caretaker flashback and the fact that he gains memory by reading his note book.)
Everyone else in the story didn’t remember seeing the skippers because it had not happened yet. Now we are supposed to believe someone is having a memory of something that didn’t happen yet?
I think he didn’t know that Ben was going to turn the wheel, but after it happened, he realized Char was in trouble and checked the note book, realized he COULD interact with Des (constant) and tried to get him to contact mom for help. To no avail because of course correction….she’s gone.
Comment 334, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Was Faraday one of the workers in the cave when Candle ran in and told them to stop drilling?
Comment 335, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
So you are saying that Daniel has ALREADY time traveled to warn Charlotte, but that he doesn’t REMEMBER doing so? So maybe when we saw Daniel in the 70’s in S5E1, it was something that already happened as opposed to what WOULD happen eventually.
Okay, I will buy it. Partially because it lets my encyclopedia analogy stand! LOL
: ) P
Comment 336, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Comment 337, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
And her ending up on the island WAS the course correction because she should have died in the purge.
++++++++++++++++++OOPS! Sorry, meant to separate my comments from Hammers, or PJs, or Newbies, lost track!!!-Liz
+++++++++++++++++++++++++
That is just so dark!!!
What gets me about all this is the lack of true ability to affect ANYTHING–
Comment 338, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
So you are saying that Daniel has ALREADY time traveled to warn Charlotte, but that he doesn’t REMEMBER doing so? So maybe when we saw Daniel in the 70’s in S5E1, it was something that already happened as opposed to what WOULD happen eventually.
Okay, I will buy it. Partially because it lets my encyclopedia analogy stand! LOL
: ) P
Yep, I hope this helps my cause:
From S5E1:
SAWYER: How do you know so much about this, Danny Boy?
[Faraday removes his backpack and removes his journal from it.]
FARADAY: [Sighs] I know about this because… I’ve spent my entire adult life studying space-time. I know all this because this journal contains everything I’ve ever learned about the DHARMA Initiative. This is why I’m here. I know what’s happening.
AND LATER IN THE EPISODE:
[Faraday sighs deeply, looking at Charlotte.]
CHARLOTTE: What? Wh–what? What’s the matter?
FARADAY: You… [sighs, signaling to her upper lip, which is dripping with blood from a nostril]
CHARLOTTE: Ugh. I haven’t had a nosebleed since I was little. Dan, I’m fine.
FARADAY: Yeah. No, no, no, you’re–um, of course you’re fine. I’m, uh… you know, the sight of blood is…
CHARLOTTE: Yeah, well, it’s a good thing you’re a physicist then, isn’t it? Shall we?
FARADAY: Yeah, um… my pack. Of course I left my pack back at the hatch crater. I better get it. Why don’t you head back with everyone else? And I’ll be right behind you.
CHARLOTTE: Don’t dillydally.
FARADAY: I wouldn’t think of it.
[Charlotte chuckles. Faraday sighs. He runs for his pack, and extracts the journal, then quickly leafs through it.]
[Moments later, Faraday bangs on the back door of the hatch.]
FARADAY: [Whispering, and stepping back] Please let this work. Please let this work. Please, please, please, let this work.
Comment 339, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
————————————-
LOL, I said the same thing when we were watching… “Help! I’m not dead.. just very badly burned!” Hahaha
Comment 340, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Arrggg. Screwed mine up too. LOL
I wanted to say that it is possible that when Dan tells Sawyer that his notebook is everything he learned about DHARMA might be that he learned it all when he was with DHARMA as a spy of sorts.
And, the second point was to show that after Dan realized the skipping was effecting Char, he ran to his note book and realized he could try to use Des to get help.
I’m just confusing now, eh?
Comment 341, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hahahaha!!! How great was that scene in the van w/ Ben, Jack and Sun. Not only did this scene make me laugh my ass off, but Ben’s little tantrum was extremely telling in the grand scheme of things. Just look at him this scene: his frustration is totally genuine. You all are asking if Ben is one of the good guys. Many of you believe that he’s bad. For those of you that think he’s the villain this is the episode that should change your minds. If you believe like I do, Benjamin Linus is stuck in an extremely difficult role. He has to protect, guide, and ensure the success of select people through certain tasks, but without giving them any of the information explaining why they must do these things. He’s bouncing from place to place, source to source, trying to hold everything together while all other forces are aligning against him. And now here he’s got Jack and Sun, plotting backseat vengeance against him.
At the end of the episode, although he’s lost half his audience, Ben lays a lot of this stuff on the line. He uses Jin’s wedding ring as a tool to get Sun back to the island; ironic since Jin asked Locke to use it for the exact opposite purpose. Somewhere along the line we now know that Ben met up with Locke. Going one step further, I’m going to suggest that Ben’s responsible for Jeremy Bentham being dead, too. Does that cancel his good guy status? I don’t think so. The rest of this season should clear up (I’m hoping) the reasons behind his “bad” guy image. He fluctuates back and forth but in the end i say Ben is Good.
Comment 342, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
sector7 wrote:
You are right, however, Ben WAS selected as the island leader at a very young age. Locke never was meant to lead the island. He failed the tests as we saw last year. Locke was merely Ben’s “leader” for a period of time, about 10 minutes, as long as it took Ben to move the wheel. Not the same as being the island leader, IMO. Truth is Locke is very gullible and merely a pawn in this game of chess.
DocH wrote:
Great point DocH. The 70 hours must mean something to the island skipping.
Comment 343, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
~~~~~~
Maybe Faraday is an Alpert of sorts and doesn’t age.
He could try to use Des to help, because he is blinded by his love of Charlotte and hopes he can break his own rules of course correction and save her
Comment 344, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Comment 345, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
LOL. You are putting up a good argument for both sides I think. On one hand, Dan admittingly had never tried it “Please, Please, let this work”. But on the other hand, maybe he did try it and needed the journal for reference because of his memory problems.
Comment 346, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Just to shorten up the post, I’ll say this:
My theory is that Dan already told Char and doesn’t remember it.
Opposing theory is Char remembers something that Dan didn’t do yet, but will.
Agree to disagree until futher info gained?
Comment 347, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
****************************************
haha, so it’s possible to be a murderer, master-maniplutor, kidnapper and a compulsive liar and be good?? interesting…;)
I actually totally understand and get your point but i think that his tantrum, like everything else he does, was totally calculated and designed to get a certain response/action…
it’s the age old debate and something tells me it will still be open to debate when the show has come to it’s conclusion, but i say that AT BEST, Ben is neither ‘good’ nor ‘bad’, just someone who does whatever it takes to reach his own goals and further his own agenda (which actually in my book kinda makes him a bad guy by definition;)…
i personally find it very hard to consider him a good guy, although maybe you’re right and the reasons why will be fully revealed by the end of the series…
either way, i LOVE this show…;)
Comment 348, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Too late.:)
Comment 349, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
i agree with you and think that Dan already told her and doesn’t remember it…i would even say that maybe Dan DOES remember telling a ‘little girl’ to leave and not come back or she would die but maybe wasn’t aware that the little girl was Charlotte until she told him about it…haha, how’s that? ;)
Comment 350, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LizS wrote:
Comment 351, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Did anyone else find it interesting how Locke suddenly changed and needed to get off the island to help when all the other seasons, he NEVER wanted to leave? He knows what the island is – as he said in last season’s finale when talking to Jack “It’s not an island. It’s a place where miracles happen.” Locke could not walk before. He can on the island. But then he leaves the island to help the others (castaways). That’s quite altruistic. He might be crippled being off the island but he goes anyway.
Comment 352, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
sector7 wrote:
______________________________________
Sayid’s LOL quote of the week:
“If I ever see you or him again, it will be extremely unpleasant for all of us.”
Comment 353, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
I don’t think course correction is a theory in the show’s writing. It is fact. It happens.
Comment 354, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Frank wrote:
**************************************
i have come to the conclusion that Locke is somewhat of a fool and definitely a pawn…JMO…;)
Comment 355, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
That’s true. I believe in the course correction on certain parts of the show, sorry. I just don’t think the time traveling thing is. I think everything has happened exactly like it was supposed to. Kinda like I don’t think Charlie was supposed to die saving Claire. i think Des saw all that to save him so that he would die when he did. He would have been one of the only people to figure out that code. That is when he was SUPPOSED to die. That is what I believe anyway. It was his destiny!!
Comment 356, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
Ummmm….Hawking told Des all about it. Man with red shoes ring any bells?
Comment 357, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
just so i’m sure i understand, can you give one example of how we know that course correction a fact? i think i’m missing something…BIG surprise…;)
Comment 358, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
After reading what I just wrote in comment 355, I am going to contradict myself…maybe he should have just died in the first place. I give up!
Comment 359, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
thanks, that’s it! i knew i was missing/forgetting something…;)
Comment 360, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ESB wrote:
***********************************************
This is what i love about this site ESB, one minute i think one way and the next i am swayed a bit in the opposite direction. Who is in need of an LAA meeting? :) i am
Comment 361, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ESB wrote:
+++++++++++++
I don’t think anyone has proved it a fact…but a theory in the show? Here you go:
As she and Desmond turn around, a pair of legs with red shoes were shown sticking out from under the pile of rubble. As Desmond realized this is the man she pointed out earlier, she admitted to knowing that he would die. When confronted by Desmond as to why she did not warn the man she informed him that he would have been hit by a taxi the next day, and if she had warned him about that he would have broken his neck in the shower. As Desmond stared blankly at her, she explained that the universe has a way of “course correcting” (a phrase Desmond later recites to Charlie), and that death cannot be avoided.
Comment 362, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
also, sorry that i keep forgetting to separate quotes…i’ll work on that…
Comment 363, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ESB wrote:
342 ESB.:) GMTA
Comment 364, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
Ho, ho, ho! I like you’re thinking–not that I agree with it, but some kick-butt ideas. I’m not buying into Jacob being a Force for good–he’s real easy with advising people to kill other people. Now, call me old-fashioned, but I seem to recall somewhere that there’s commandment or something against that.
I’m not buying into Ben being ‘good’ either, but I will give you that he thinks he’s doing what he does for ‘the good’. Somehow, I just don’t think his ideas of what that The GOOD is will end up in my ballpark, or be good for my favorite characters.
Locke–I used to think he was the ’soul’ of the Island, when I thought there was some ultimate good in betwixt all the bad, but then he went all whacko on us. Can you say walking out of the jungle and throwing a machete at a woman, then walking away? Hellooo, John, where has your soul gone???? So far, this season, tho, he does seem to be back on that track of good. However, he trusts the undead waaaay too easily.
But Ben is an awesome character! that I agree on 100%
Liz
Comment 365, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
D & C have stated it in their podcasts.
Comment 366, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
me too Jaime…and regardless of whether he’s good or bad, Ben is one of my favorite parts of the show…he can super creepy or pretty damn funny, sometimes at the same time, and you either end up loving him or loving to hate him…i personally love to hate him…;)
Comment 367, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
LOL, no, that actually makes sense to me! And the journal has traveled through time and made it to his desk in the future, and he’s trying to unravel all the bits, or, er, uh, yah, something like that there.
Liz
Comment 368, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
I watched that many times. I am just trying to say that if Charlotte was meant to die in the Purge, I think it would have corrected itself a long time ago. I don’t think she is going to die just because she came back to the island. I think it would have already course corrected. The theory or course correction and time travel seems like a theory to me. The universe has a way or correcting itself. It seems to me that everyone is changing things. The universe course correcting is like the universe making things happen the way its are supposed to be. Unavoidable circumstances are not bringing the )^ back, Ben, Locke, and Hawking are doing it. She couldn’t change Desmond’s mind to give the ring to penny, he did it himself.
Now I said I am giving up because if Des had just let Charlie die and not save him, none of this would have happened. Besides I think Des’s vision was crap because I never saw a helicopter come pick up Claire and the baby. Charlie died for nothing:(
So this is why I am getting swayed into another direction now. It’s so great how this show does this to me!
Comment 369, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
yeah i figured somone would’ve said it before my post…i don’t think it’s an original sentiment at this point…;)
Comment 370, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ESB wrote:
Actually I think we are in the minority on that subject. It appears that most people believe he was meant to be the island leader.
Comment 371, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
+++++++++++
IMO, Keamy killing Alex is what started all this. Keamy broke the ‘rules’, Ben got pissed and turned the wheel….
Comment 372, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
*********************************
hmm, interesting…for someone who is meant to be the island leader, he sure doesn’t seem to have any clue what he’s doing most of the time, haha…;)
Comment 373, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Frank wrote:
Yeah, the Island was good for John, in some ways, the island of miracles, and for Rose, cured of cancer, and maybe there are other miracles out there.
But there’s a whole lot of crappola overshadowing the good! Maybe Jacob hijacked the island for his own twisted purpose, or people trying to own it, wrecks it, a la the (apparent) struggle between Widmore and Ben for supremacy of some sort or other, or something…
But John’s willingness to sacrifice his life for The Island, the object that is most important to him–hmm, I think it could go either way, either he is the big hero of everything, or he is being duped.
Comment 374, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
Found it. From Lostpedia. Feb. 28, 2008.
Carlton Cuse: The hard thing about this episode was actually structuring the time travel elements – or consciousness traveling elements – and avoiding paradox. But that again is something that I think a lot of people have speculated about – “are there parallel futures, are there sort of multiple universes and worlds that exist in the future depending on how events in the past play out?” and that is not our intention.
Damon Lindelof: Yeah, and Ms. Hawking basically explained those rules in the first episode, “Flashes Before Your Eyes” where she basically said that the universe has a way of course correcting, so even if you did something in the past that you didn’t do before, somehow the sort of fabric of time like swoops in around you and fixes everything so things don’t go off the rails. I assume probably after “The Constant” we’re going to get a lot of questions like “Well, did Penny know when she went to go see Desmond at the stadium in 2001 that he had told her to wait by the phone back in 1994?” and all of these questions, and to that we say refer to the Ms. Hawking scene in “Flashes Before Your Eyes”. She gives a fairly good explanation of how everything works.
Comment 375, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I’m sure it’s been tossed around in other previous episodes’ blogs, but it seems obvious that Ben has already experienced everything that is happening. The reason he “always has a plan.” He never really tells people everything even though he knows it for good reason: it would only complicate the course correcting he is already trying to achieve.
The only thing that seems to surprise him is the death of Alex (maybe the island getting rid of anything that would cause Ben to act selfishly). Regardless, it’s apparent that he’s trying to do the same thing as Faraday – correcting the course. The difference is “love” will not keep him from completing his task. The Charlotte bit will make Faraday act in his own interest when changing the course, even if it is ineffective (Charlotte dies anyway).
So Faraday will probably be another issue Ben has to deal with (kill?) in order to get everything back on track.
In essence, because Ben doesn’t love or have ties to anyone he is the person for the job. Maybe with some promise of reincarnation from the “smokey/temple” enlightenment?
Comment 376, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Oh yeah – all that to say: Ben is a good guy.
Comment 377, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
“Ben is good”?!?! Wait, you seem to have forgotten Ben orchestrated a mass murdered on his own people including his father! Ben is very bad, dont trust anything he says! … but I love his character, by far one of the best actors on this show
Comment 378, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
Comment 379, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
There is a lot of discussion about whether Ben is good or bad and good reasons from both sides, but if you recall from many of the past episodes, Ben has said from time to time to various survivors that “we’re the good guys”. We don’t believe that because he does a lot of bad things, but those bad things are essentially to protect and preserve the Island and their way of life on the Island.
Things are said for a reason on the show, so it’s possible that Ben really is good and he does whatever he deems necessary to protect and preserve the Island from the bad guys.
We learned Whidmore is inherently bad when he killed one of his own in cold blood (snapped his neck) in the 1950’s to prevent Locke et al. from finding their camp. We know he’s still bad because he hired the mercenaries to find Ben who killed people in their path. We also saw him on a video beating up a guy in an ally that was shown to Michael to convince him to be a spy on Whidmore’s boat.
The Others have a rule never to kill one of their own.
Comment 380, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
You totally stole your comments from Doc Jensen at ew.com at least have the courtesy to tell where you got if from and stop taking credit for someone else’s work.
Comment 381, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
The last paragraph is directly quoted from the ew.com article. You should be ashamed that you cannot come up with ideas yourself.
Comment 382, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
Dr. Walter Bishop is chasing him down with a quickness.
Comment 383, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
BaileyLovesLost wrote:
Locke would go against his promise to Jin because he believes that ALL must return to save them. He has said as much at least 3 times this season alone.
Comment 384, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
+++
I think that Daniel had traveled back in time before. I’m not sure whether to believe that only his mind traveled (like Desmond) or his entire self, body and mind. His reaction to the plane crash on TV in Season 4, as alluded in some posts, probably has to do with his realization that his mind and body time-traveling journey will begin very soon, whereas before it was only his mind traveling? But for your mind to travel to a certain time, wouldn’t your body have had to be present in that time? I am soooo confused!!
But whatever the inner workings of time-traveling may be, I do think that Ben turning the FDW is not the first time Daniel has time-traveled. I think his journal entries on the DI are from when his ‘mind’ traveled to that time.
So I think he told Charlotte and has forgotten because of the problems with his memory.
Comment 385, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ESB wrote: “i have come to the conclusion that Locke is somewhat of a fool and definitely a pawn…”
That truism should be promoted to eleventh commandment. He has always been played on the show – how will he redeem himself – by giving his life… even though he is getting played in the process.
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me three times, change my name to Locke and send me on Walk-Abouts down under. If saps and suckers had there own money… Locke’s picture would be on every bill. (too harsh?)
Comment 386, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
But I LOVE Walter! (and I love Peter more!)
: ) P
Comment 387, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
pandakim wrote:
The baby may not be Miles, but I really DON’T think it was Charlotte:
http://tinyurl.com/babychang
: ) P
Comment 388, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Before Char died was there another flash? Maybe they went to the day of the purge and that is why Char died? Maybe she was to die in the purge? But needed to be in the right time? Any thoughts?
Comment 389, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasker wrote:
Ben always has a plan because that’s how he is. Smart, and far-sighted. And ruthless. Any tool to hand, any emotion, any knowledge of anyone’s flaws/wishes/hopes/dreams, all are fair game. No one, not even the Benster, can cover all the bases, however, thus, he couldn’t save Alex. And he DOES love–inasmuch as he is capable of it. He loved Alex, Annie, and Juliette. Though none of them as much as he loves the old Ben. IMO
Comment 390, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Frank wrote:
The altruistic thing is that he knows he has to die to do it. He is ONLY leaving because he believes its his destiny to do so and to lead the others.
Comment 391, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
K-Mac wrote:
Yeeah, but, no. We know for sure one thing about Benjamin Linus, he’s a liar. And we know whatever his ultimate agenda is, he is ruthless in its pursuit. Yeah, so he protects his own. Well, they’re HIS. And, honestly, how many bad/awful/murderous things can a person do and still be ‘good’? End justify the means??? That would take a whole lot of justifying!!!
Comment 392, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
Ooh, I love Walter, too!!! Wasn’t that so cool about the manifesto? Walter is the bomb. Love FRINGE. Ahem, but we digress.
–Liz
Comment 393, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LizS wrote:
I am not weighing in on either side, YET, but if the end is saving the entire population of earth ( roughly 6.7 billion people), I would say the means are justified. Truth is, we don’t know what the end is.
Comment 394, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
http://www.docarzt.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/the-numbers-transmission.mp3
found this on Docartz blog site…suggesting that the voice you hear on the transmission from Rousseau’s teams radio is Hurley’s voice saying the numbers.. any thoughts???????
Comment 395, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
geribnj wrote:
eh. I can hear why someone might think so, but I don’t think that is Hurley/Jorge Garcia.
: ) P
Comment 396, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I just read at ew.com that we learned last year that Charlotte’s dad is named David Lewis. Has anyone found this info elsewhere?
Comment 397, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Just did some research. Charlotte states in “confirmed dead” that she was raised in Bromsgrove Worcestershire, England by David and Jeanette Lewis, her father and mother.
Comment 398, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
When Ben gave Charlotte’s vital statistics in “Confirmed Dead” S4E2, he gave that as her father’s name: Her name is Charlotte Lewis! Charlotte Staples Lewis. Born July second, nineteen seventy-nine, Essex, England. Parents David and Jeanette. Eldest of three, all girls. She was raised in Bromsgrove. Did her undergraduate studies at Kent. Took her PhD in Cultural Anthropology at Oxford. She’s here with two other team members and a pilot. Their names Daniel Faraday, Miles Straume, Frank Lapidus.
Whether or not this is true, as Charlotte knows it, or not, is up for grabs.
: ) P
Comment 399, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Also as for Rous remembering Jin when losties crashed: would you remember someone who disappearred right before your eyes twice? I would think so. This supports my theory that it did not originally occur this way. Also he was the only other person around when she killed her team but doesn’t remember? It just doesn’t make sense.
Comment 400, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
OMG! I just had an interview with some producer of this reality show I have been trying to get on. This interview was my first with them online and SOMEHOW I couldn’t even have an interview without talking about Lost. So they are like…soooo..you like Lost huh? What do you think the smoke monster is? And what do you think is going on? I didn’t expect questions like that but it’s LOST right? So I have A LOT to say and they were like WHOA! You just took this to a whole different level! Im so embarrassed! I know this is way off subject but and not discussing the episode BUT I really need a LAA meeting. I hope nobody ever sees this interview. It was recorded on video tape. What if he KNOWS someone from Lost and they are like, Damn this girl was interviewing for a show about phobias and couldn’t shut up about LOST! AHHHHH!
Comment 401, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZQfC5Vkn_PA
found this on youtube the season 5 promo and if you pause at 1:34 it is a subliminal for Ajira Airways convincing me that the O6ers return on this airline and thats where the bottle in the outrigger came from
Comment 402, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
—-
Oh duke; STFU.
No one elected you Hall monitor.
Don’t get your panties all soiled over nothing.
Jeez, what a crybaby. Oh, the shaaaaame!
Comment 403, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Probably already been discussed but did anyone notice that the music box Jin picks up in the camp is the one that Sayid fixes for Danielle while being held prisoner?
Comment 404, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
bolddeceiver wrote:
Yes I did.
Comment 405, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
bolddeceiver wrote:
Actually, you were the first to bring it up, and it’s been driving me crazy wondering where I’d seen it b/f. Thanks so much!
Comment 406, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
I’m with you both. Sometimes I just want to shake Locke upside down and knock some sense into the poor man.
Comment 407, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
Thanks so much for the link. That was great. I was planning on searching for it on my own but had no idea where to start. I didn’t think I remembered seeing the baby with red hair.
I think I’m going to go with the Charlotte is Annie theory…and that the reason she is so young is b/c she and her mother went down the well and turned the donkey wheel and ended up going forward in time. That one seems to make the most sense at this point in time, and also would explain her love/knowledge of the 70s. Kudos to whoever came up with that.
Also, I checked on Lostpedia & when Ben and Annie first met she gave him an Apollo bar. Maybe that had something to do with her saying something like, “I’m not supposed to have chocolate b/f bed,” right before she died?
Comment 408, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Can someone tell me who Rousseau and her people were? I thought they were scientists of some sort. Why were they armed and very military-like (cautious, ready to attack) in their actions right before the incident with the monster?
Also Charlotte and all her connections to so many people–especially Faraday– and all these statements she was making from different time periods-”marry an american”, “chocolate”, the band name, lends more credit to her being Ben or Widmore’s child.
“Some crazy man told me to not come back. Daniel that man was you” Faraday looked puzzled by that statement from Charlotte.
What was Eloise’s objective a few seasons back with Desmond in the jewelry store and her telling him stuff about marrying Penny her, the wedding ring, and that certain things have to happen like Charlie dying?
Comment 409, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
Great point PJ. Ben GAVE the stats on Charlotte. Ben is a LIAR. She did not protest though, maybe she was dumbfounded. It happens to the best of us, being dumbfounded. It has happened to Ben Linus twice now ( Alex’s death and Des’s knowledge of Faraday’s mother ).
Or was Charlotte protecting her sibs? both of her sister’s?
The eldest of 2 sisters I highly doubt. JMO.
Comment 410, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
lost4ever wrote:
___________________________________
Well, all of the stats are things that could have happened for real, post island. She and her mother left the island, and her father, behind. Her mother re-married and Charlotte became a Lewis. She could very well then be the oldest of 3 girls – with 2 half sisters. I’m still thinking that she COULD be the baby we saw in S5E1 (sorry PJ – the picture was inconclusive for me:)other shots of her/him DID seem to show reddish hair. Anyway, Charlotte mentioned that she couldn’t remember her mother’s maiden name – so we could assume she would be someone we wouldn’t know by a married name – but WOULD by a maiden name (like Widmore? Chang/Halliwax/Wickman/Candle – if her mother never married him? Could be anyone) Have we heard of a Jeanette before? I don’t remember anyone by that name.
Comment 411, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
__________________________________
He seems to be an actual physical being of some kind – remember that we saw him holding baby Aaron so he can’t be ONLY spirit. I’m still thinking that Jacob is not A person, but a collective of consciousnesses – past leaders maybe. Christian said he is NOT Jacob, but could speak for him. Perhaps not ALL of Jacob, but a part.
Comment 412, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
____________________________________
I wish they had told us what behaviors made Rousseau believe they were sick – so sick that she had to kill them. WHAT HAPPENED IN THE HOLE!!! I can’t help wondering if they came out of the hole telling fantastical sounding tales of things they had seen there, and Danielle thought they had LOST it?! Maybe they weren’t actually “sick”. (yes I know Robert also tried to kill her, but she HAD killed the other men, and she HAD just been pointing a gun at HIM afterall :)
Question: I woke up this morning wondering if Montand was calling out in ENGLISH that he was OK (but hurt) down in the hole? I don’t remember him speaking English, and wouldn’t expect him to call out to his French friends in anything but French, but I am remembering that he did – anyone remember? If he did, it would confirm a smokie trick. (I wish I had a DVR!!)
Comment 413, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
There seems to be a big “free will” element at play here. Christian wouldn’t/couldn’t help Locke get up (as a physician, you would think his instincts would be to help him). Ben won’t/can’t tell anyone things he knows, which it SEEMS would make it easier for everyone – perhaps in order to not contaminate “free will”? Ben had to bring people to the voodoo math priestess, who came of their own free will perhaps. (even if under false pretenses :)
Others of you have suggested that if Ben would just TELL people what is going on, they might be more likely to go along with him, but he NEVER tells – maybe HE ISN’T ALLOWED TO so as to not mess up free will. Like people have to choose to do something, based on gut, not based on knowledge. Just thinking out loud.
It seems that if they ARE really grooming Locke as a leader, this is how they are grooming him. No one ever really tells him anything – just keep making him figure it all out on his own – looking for gut response maybe. He keeps choosing the path that someone else suggests to him, but not necessarily the right path – like they want him to figure that out himself and go with what HIS gut is telling him. THEN he can lead.
Comment 414, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
OK, one more thing (I was so busy yesterday I had no time to post – so here it is all at once from me!):
To those who suggested that Daniel might be Charlotte’s father – remember that she grew up for awhile on the island WITH her dad, she would know him, recognize him. He memory of Dan being there was not “you were my daddy” – it was “a scary man – I think it was you” who told her to never come back to the island.
GREAT IDEAS HERE EVERYONE! Keep the ideas flowing!
Comment 415, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
Hi, Rita–nice morning musing!
Here’s my take on a few of the points you raised–
Christian not helping: it could be a TEST of John’s will, or it could be that Christian is not capable of corporeal action.
Ben not telling all he knows: not in his nature, he always needs a few cards held close to his chest, I think that’s just the way he is. And he was, I think, afraid of Jacob, if I recall, jealous that John ‘heard’, saw, that shadow of the Great Man, or whatever Jacob is (maybe a being stuck outside time and space or in its vortex). Ben’s agenda may have changed since he left the Island, maybe Hawking changed it for him.
Locke’s leadership: well, I wonder if Alpert, the non-leader but always there, is playing him. If the Island is playing him, preying on his heart’s desire. They certainly don’t entrust him with much in the way of info! Puppet on a lonely string? uh, yeah, too much Cold Play.
Free Will v. Fate–there are conflicting messages about this throughout the show, but I think it’s more slanted to Man of Science v. Man of Faith, whatever that episode was titled. Locke is a man of Faith, and he clearly needs to believe in something, NEEDS it, and that overshadows his ability to question the value of what’s behind his Faith. He believes that in doing what [he perceives] ‘The Island’ wants him to do, he is fulfilling his destiny, and that gives his life meaning and purpose.
So he gives up his judgment, lets it be subsumed by his Faith, lets his obsession lead to Boone’s death, and kills random chicks, all in the course of his NEED. Even his moments of doubt are part of the pilgrims path. Now he’s found IT–the Island that he loves wants him to leave in order to save it. He doesn’t question the validity of this, or the method he’s receiving the message, or the good intentions of the mysterious Jacob.
Because he NEEDS to believe. And he is willing to sacrifice all for that.
Faith is a powerful thing, and it can blind you to the truth, or lead you to it. The jury’s out on what John’s choices will ultimately lead him to.
Cheers, Liz
Comment 416, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Have y’all discussed Christian symbolism? Sorry if you already went there in previous times–I just thought it was an interesting frame of the Church where Madame Hawking is doing her calculations, juju, metaphysical math, whatever. The Good Shepherd Himself, arms open, inviting the faithful to worship.
Hmm. We have all the philosophical giants–Rousseau, Locke, et al, the science giants-Hawking (I know there were a few others, can’t pull ‘em out at the moment), and the Sheppards….Christian, Jack, & Claire. 3’s a big number in Christian Symbolism.
Hmm.
Faith, Sacrifice, The Good–and what they mean to modern man (Locke-philosopher-some kinda savant, or fool, maybe, which would also have its place in the scheme of things— Jack’s confidence in medicine/science, which doesn’t ground him, his struggles to find his center and the place where he can act from, his apparent resignation to the ‘fact’ he needs to go back to the dreaded Island ((well, otherwise we’d have no show)) his love for Kate and overcoming the obstacles to winning her, blah, blah)
Good be another layer of meaning, or kitchen-sink-ism. Any thoughts?
Cheers, Liz
Comment 417, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
first off locke is not a fool.
second ben needs to go back to being the “bad” guy.
third we need protagonists and antagonists on this show again. ever since ben became the “good” guy we’ve been missing the age old recipe of good vs. evil for a good story. that ben’s outburst was so so lame.
if ben is going to stay “good” then someone needs to step up and be “bad”, badder than ben ever was. unfortunately there isn’t enough time left to develop widmore into that kind of bad.
fourth we need to have someone not change their goddang minds every other episode!!! sun was ohh so convinced against ben…poof!!! that anger is gone. sayid was ohh so convinced about ben…poof!!! gone!!! can anyone on this show have or show some conviction please??? there IS something called intuition and the writers have given NO CREDIT to intuition only to friggin time travelers. it’s not the same thing.
question:
how did locke die? did ben kill locke? and how did everyone up here know that faraday’s mother is that weird lady? i probly read it but i forgot.
btw this season makes me want to go back and watch rest of the seasons.
Comment 418, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ALSO, and then I’m shutting up, promise, the Faith-Hope-Love triangle, and the ‘greatest of these is Love’
Is the ability to Love, and be loved, going to count for anything in the ultimate smack-down of this show?
Already, Love saved Desmond. And Penny’s Faith in him saved him, despite all her doubts.
Love Des & Pen, Happy Valentine’s Day! just about
Comment 419, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
dealer wrote:
Well, we can hope that will prove out! He’s done some questionable things, and there’s no proof that his faith is placed in the right things/beings.
For me, his character was trashed last year, and I’m not quite over that.
Comment 420, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
dealer wrote:
_________________________
I hear you, and I think that we are MEANT to feel their frustration. I see it as not so much flip-flopping as being VERY conflicted. They never have been able to know who to trust, who not to trust.
Comment 421, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
i think there is a portal on the island that goes to tunisia.
all of charotte’s carthage talk made me look into it. “Polybius wrote in the sixth book of his History that the Carthaginians were “more exercised in maritime affairs than any other people.”
AND…this was the clencher for me…
there was a rivalry with Hanno “Magnus”.
MAGNUS HANSO anyone????!!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Carthage#Hanno_.22Magnus.22
Comment 422, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
I thought the same thing about the “sickness” myself.
I think you are correct about Montand calling out in English from the hole! I haven’t watch the episode again, and the transcript on LOSTpedia has only Act 1 so far. Hmmmm.
: ) P
Comment 423, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
So an emerging theme seems to be: can the future be changed? So far it seems it can’t, and even people with some experience with time are futilly trying. Whidmore can’t stop Des and Penny getting together ; Daniel can’t save Charlotte. But maybe that’s Ben and Locke’s ultimate goal–to actually change future events.
Comment 424, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Bobola wrote:
Just pointing out that that guy stole his ideas directly from ew.com. Why are you defending such a moron? It had nothing to do with you. Idiot.
Comment 425, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
*************************************************
hey now, I by no means am trying to “steal” anyones work If i find something that is worth sharing or having a debate/discussion about i will share it. And if you look back through the posts i do say that “i can’t take cred for certain topics. But thanks Lost police for staying on top of it.
Comment 426, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LizS wrote:
Good catch on the Christian symbolism. It underlies many themes of the show, for example, Locke’s sacrifice to save the people on the Island, Jack’s last name is Sheppard and he is/was the leader of the survivors. How people don’t die in dangerous situations because the Island’s purpose for those people have not yet ended and when their purposes is fulfilled, they die. The fact that some many people of Oceanic 815 survived the crash in the way that it happened suggests that there is a supernatural force that caused it to happened, and saved those people for a reason. In the previous episode, Sawyer asked Locke why he didn’t go tell himself at the hatch to avoid all the pain he went through and Locke said he had to go through that pain in order to get to where he is now–a belief that everything happens for a reason, a Chistian view of their life journey, etc.
Comment 427, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
***************************************************
Ok so i guess i will preface the discussion with “this is from EW.online” . Its not as though people praise me on my thoughts and i gratuitously take the compliments. So ashamed i am not, i love doing research on certain topics that we are all discussing and throwing out ideas. I definitely have my own theories on the ins and outs of the show and I share those as well. Whats the need for the harshness. Don’t take yourself so seriously. You my friend are in need a a serious LAA meeting.
Comment 428, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LizS wrote:
I mentioned last week or the week before that I was revising my view on the “Man of Science Man of Faith” episode. Originally it seemed that Jack was the man of science and Locke the man of faith, but now I think that in the end Jack SHEPHERD will be the man of faith.
Comment 429, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think it is very obvious that throughout the show they have showed us that Locke is someone who NEEDS to feel wanted. He will do/act anyway that he thinks will endear him to the person and/or group that he is actively participating in. He lived on the commune and got manipulated by the undercover cop. He got manipulated out of his kidney by his father. Ben manipulated him into numerous things while being held prisoner and then manipulated him into blowing up the submarine. He may now be getting manipulated by the island/Jacob/Alpert whoever is pulling the strings. They realize that he has this NEED and will do whatever is necessary to “fit in” or be loved so they use that to get him to do their dirty work. I do not believe that he is DESTINED to lead the others but is being played by those in charge to carry out their tasks.
Comment 430, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
************************
Thanks Bobola,
And Duke, a moron? Is that really necessary? Last thing I’ll say about this topic. I never stated that they were MY ideas. Just put them out for discussion. Oh, and I’m a girl not a guy. :) Happy Friday to you, try to smile a bit it may help
Comment 431, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
Not taking myself too seriously. If you come up with YOUR own idea and lay it out there that is one thing but STEALING someone else’s and passing it of as your’s is just juvenile. Doing research and coming up with ideas is fine but that isn’t what you did. You quoted word for word what someone else’s idea was and said it as if it were your own.
Comment 432, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jamie and Bobola,
I wasn’t trying to offend anyone just state where you got certain things so that we can check out the entire article. In my opinion, it just looks bad when you plagarize someone else’s work. At least have the decency to re-word it next time. It is really no big deal. Just pointing it out to the masses. If you didn’t feel bad about it you wouldn’t be so pissed. You got busted and admitted it so move on.
Comment 433, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
OK, here are some thoughts. I’m not sure where this is going, but maybe someone can help.
Jack
Pre-Island: Abusing drugs/ alcohol, paranoid behavior pushes away the woman he loves.
On Island: Leader, confident, strong.
Post-Island: Abusing drugs/ alcohol, paranoid behavior pushes away the woman he loves.
Hurley
Pre-Island: Followed by bad luck, in the loony bin.
On Island: Good luck (VW van started), productive (saves Losties during conflict with Others on beach).
Post-Island: Followed by bad luck, in the loony bin.
Sayid
Pre-Island: Assassin and torturer.
On Island: Repentant, leader.
Post-Island: Assasin and torturer.
Kate
Pre-Island: On the run, making the wrong decisions (and getting people like her childhood sweetheart killed in the process).
On Island: One of the more competent people, trusted and respected.
Post-Island: On the run (for now, plus why did she have a stack of “ready to take off on short notice” cash?), making the wrong decisions (?).
Sun:
This one is a little complicated, but she seems to have turned into someone motivated and driven by revenge and hate, willing to hurt and kill people. Before island time she condenmed her father and Jin for doing the same/ or similar thing.
This all seems to be connected somehow, and I’m sure there is some connection to why the O6 must/ or eventually will return.
Comment 434, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
********************************************
Not pissed at all. I didn’t get “busted” cause i didn’t do anything wrong. I ALWAYS state when i can’t take the cred and i will continue doing the same thing. So that you may rest easy my cranky one, i will preface all things from other sites from here on out even if its a minuscule piece of info. I have been coming to this site for the last 4 seasons and have been a part of MANY wonderful discussions so i know the rules. You say you don’t mean to offend but you call me a “moron” and Bobola and “idiot”. Its people like you that chase others away. This will be the last time i comment (to you at least). I do apologies the the rest of you for having to read and deal with this nonsense. On with the important conversations :)
Comment 435, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
Agree Miraks. I’ll say…course correction. Locke has said it before, they are supposed to be there, they weren’t supposed to leave.
Comment 436, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
Shall i even say the word….destiny. Locke may be on to something. Or else it could be simply that the island is, as he would say, “magical”
Comment 437, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
_________________________________
How about Sun:
Pre-island: manipulative, cunning, liar and adulter.
On-island: friend to many, reliable, helpful, repentant and loving wife.
Post-island: manipulative, cunning, schemer, would-be killer.
Comment 438, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Have any of you read this person’s theory?
http://timelooptheory.com/the_timeline.html
Comment 439, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
***********************************************
Shall i even say the word….destiny. Locke may be on to something. Or else it could be simply that the island is, as he would say, “magical”
*************************************
Oooh yes Hammer, even better
Comment 440, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
umm, i think some of you take yourselves, and this blog way to seriously…let’s try to remember that it’s just a tv show…a tv show WE ALL enjoy…;)
Comment 441, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
oh and ps- i think Jaime is cool, haha ;)
Comment 442, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
++++++++++++++
Well, I guess course correction and destiny are related in this case. GMTA.
p.s. Avoid temptation. :)
Comment 443, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
The connection is obvious. They were nobody before the island and now they are nobody again. At least on the island they were SOMEBODY. I don’t understand why they were so damn desperate to get off and why they are so reluctant to go back. I wish everyday that I was on that island! I watch music videos on YouTube thinking I WANT TO BE SPECIAL! I want to crash on an island like that! It’s my DESTINY damnit!
Comment 444, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
*************************************
to over simplify…it is interesting that in a lot ways, the Island seems to bring out the best in people, but back in the real world they can’t seem to escape from who they are…and it remoinds of the question (asked by Swayer, i think) why would you want to leave? why would you want to go back to the ‘real world’? hmmm…;)
Comment 445, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
sorry Tasha, i was typing and didn’t read your post until i posted mine…not trying to be repetitive…and, wow does my typing suck…;)
Comment 446, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ESB wrote:
++++++++++++++++
Well, in their defense, their lives have been threatened on a regular basis. :)
Comment 447, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
I think that at first everyone thought they were SUPPOSE to want off the island. You know, your plane crashes, you are suppose to want to get back to your normal life. A few people (Rose, Locke) figured out early that they DIDN’T WANT what they were suppose to want, that they wanted to stay on the island. The others didn’t understand that at all. My point? :) It’s about CHOICE, Free Will again. Being able to think outside the box, and to not just want what you think you are suppose to want, but to think for yourself. Those who get this are the real leaders – the ones the island has “healed”.
Comment 448, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ESB wrote:
Well I can think of a few reasons they might like to get back to civilization: grocery stores, competent indoor plumbing, lack of smoke monsters, predictable predators (versus Others / polar bears / mercenaries and again, smoke monsters). Additionally, I think there is an innate need in most people to return to what is familiar, especially after a time of peril. EVEN if that familiar is NOT good. An example of this is severely abused children who want ONLY to return to the home they know, despite the abuse perpetrated there.
Having said all that, I certainly understand why Sawyer was willing to stay!
: ) P
Comment 449, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
kindly wrote:
I have seen that before. I read it last season and though long winded, it had some good points. I have not re-read it since this season’s time traveling has occurred so I cannot comment on whether or not that person’s concept of time-travel was correct (with respect to D&C’s established “rules” thus far) or indeed, adapted since D&C’s rules have been more clearly defined.
Thank you for reminding us about it!
: ) P
Comment 450, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJ & Hammer,
haha, good points and touche! ;)
Comment 451, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
of all of them, Kate is the one that should’ve wanted to leave the least…at least i’d personally rather be on that island, then rotting in a prison cell…which is where she thought she’d be headed…haha, luckily that was not in the script and she beat the rap…;)
Comment 452, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
I am kinda an outdoorsy (is that a word?) person. I love going camping and being out without technology. I like to believe when Dec 21, 2012 hits I am going to be one of the people that survives…LOL. Anyhow, so if I were on that plane, I would so totally never want to leave. Also, I feel like I can relate to those people…I don’t have the greatest life. I mean I love my life, but I have issues and things about me that nobody knows. I also love history and mystery.
I think Smoky would love me and want me to stay!
Comment 453, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
Comment 454, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Personally, if I came back after 108 days on the island (and thus after the 2004 election) I probably would not have minded going back for a few years at least LOL
Comment 455, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Back to the is Ben/ Jacob/ Locke good/ bad discussion.
I’m starting to agree with people who are a bit sceptical of Jacob. Jacob(what or who ever he is) does seem to be on the same team as Christian, who never struck me as the most trustworthy person. Also, Claire has been hanging out with them which led her to panic at the thought of Aaron being brought back. Something is fishy there.
Comment 456, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
+++++++++
War is keeping that island running. During peace time, they couldn’t even have babies, now with war, there’s kids coming back!
LOL….ROTFL….
Comment 457, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I believe that Ben chose Locke because he knew his history and therefore could manipulate him into doing whatever Ben wanted him to do. He is not the chosen leader.
Comment 458, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
i totally agree…Locke is the chosen puppet…;)
Comment 459, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Locke is definitely naive about a lot of things, but he has a gift and can hear Jacob. I think Jacob won’t let Ben take total advantage of Locke (even though he’s dead off the island). Locke will be redeemed.
Comment 460, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
i personally believe that at the end of this show, Locke will be a beaten and broken man, used and abused by fate and forces he never quite understood…alone and full of doubt and despair…there might be redemption for some, but not that one…
haha, then again i could be TOTALLY wrong…guess we’ll see…you all have a good weekend…;)
Comment 461, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
duke wrote:
~~~~~~~~
Ben has no choice over who takes over after him. He tried to thwart Locke by embarassing him in front of the group. But Alpert came to his aid. Ben has lost control of the island and is trying desperately to get it back. Thats why he turned the wheel instead of Locke, he knew what it would do.
Comment 462, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
geribnj wrote:
*********************************************
There is further discussion now that it might be Frank Lapidus. It actually kind of sounds like him. What do you think geribnj?
Comment 463, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
__________________________________
I agree that something is not right. Claire was VEHEMENT that Kate NOT bring Aaron back. Others have been warned by presumably dead people to NOT come back, though Charlie told Hurley TO come back. No consences of the dead.
Comment 464, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
++++++++++++
That may because some are apparitions, some are manifestations. When they become whisperers, they may not be on the same ’side’.
Char told Jin that Sun or Ji or both are not to come back. Which side visited her?
I am thinking that the Claire that Kate saw wasn’t Claire, but a manifestation. Why you ask? Because she had no problem with Christian at the cabin, in fact she was eerily content and new that John was going to move the island. Now Christian is helping John bring everyone back.
What’s that you say? That was before Ben moved the island and screwed up the deal? Well yes, but that means that Aaron would have never left, so either way she was expecting Aaron to stay on the island. Hence, Kate’s Claire isn’t the real Claire…..I think.
Comment 465, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
And, if you remember, it was a DREAM that Kate had. Which means it is much less likely to be a visit from a whisperer, if, in fact, Claire IS a whisperer.
My vote is manifestation / nightmare rather than true visit.
: ) P
Comment 466, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita wrote:
I have to disagree. Charlotte wasn’t dead yet when she said that. Also, it hasn’t been confirmed Claire is dead unless I missed that in a podcast or something….BUT I do agree it is creepy and makes you question it.
Comment 467, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote: I am thinking that the Claire that Kate saw wasn’t Claire, but a manifestation.
You got me thinking (bad Hammer!)… IF Smokey is pretending to be the voice of the armless French guy Smokey dragged in to the hole? Maybe Smokey has been “imitating” other people we have seen. If Smokey looks you in the eye, and then let’s you go/live… you are good to go. No impersonation act, etc… you might as well just join the Others/hostiles. Now, if Smokey met you and he still wants to kick your butt (drag Locke underground) – you probably aren’t the stellar human-being you thought you were.
(Eko – dead, Juliet – alive, who else?
Comment 468, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
+++++++++++
Agree with you.
Comment 469, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
++++++++++
Yes, there was a podcast where D&C said of ‘visits’ like Yemi, wet Walt and Kate’s horse, etc. that some are manifestations (which I believe to be Smokey) and some are apparitions.
So I think you are correct that Smokey is an imitator.
But you left out our new scenario. What does it mean when he sends lets you go, but your are not quite yourself (French toast anyone?)? Since Alex was able to kill them, they weren’t manifestations, their bodies were killed.
Comment 470, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Oops. I said Alex but mean Danielle….Hammuedian slip.
Comment 471, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
*****************************************************
Kate was handcuffed to Juliet when Smokey flashed them. They hid in the trees to “escape”
Comment 472, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
_________________________________
It seemed that Montand looked Smokey “in the eye” and turned his back on Smokey to see his group – it was THEN that Smokey grabbed him and dragged him through the jungle and into his hole. I guess you don’t turn your back on Smokey!
Comment 473, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Maybe Smokey is lonely so if he doesn’t want to kill you, then he drags you down his hole, turns into something or someone else, such as Jacob. Has a cup of coffee and tells the people the secret of the island. Then Free Will kicks in.
They get out and…after that i don’t know. I kind of think I have second thoughts of whether Danielle’s team was really sick. He is acting a little nuts but she seemed crazy too. He might have known she was going to end up killing him so he wanted to kill her first. Horrible thing to do, but….I would like to see what happened in between the time they went down the hole and when she shot him. I was hoping that was what the whole episode was about and was kind of disappointed that we didn’t get too much out of it. OH WAIT! Of course we did! They answered questions that just brought up MORE questions!
Comment 474, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Miraks wrote:
How do we know when Annie left?
Comment 475, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
+++++++++++++++++
Perhaps Ben thought everyone on the freighter and the Helo would die when he killed Keamy and therefore, wouldn’t be leaving.
Comment 476, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Circus Mom wrote:
___________________________________
Or, he doesn’t ever interfer with Free Will. He lets people do whatever they feel they need to do, no matter what he knows the consequences will be.
Comment 477, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Ok I have a couple of questions but I don’t know if they had been asked yet. I just want to know what other people are thinking.
1. Rousseau had previously said that the others took her people. This past episode we see that she murdered them because they had been taken by the monster. Was that just a fluke or is that something that should be paid more attention??
2. Desmond has met Eloise*,Daniel’s mother before. Is he going to be sent back to the island as well?
3. Sun was already pregnant before she left the island so does it matter that she doesn’t have her daughter with her??
4. Does anyone have any theories on how and why Jack’s father has become so pivotal?
Comment 478, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jamal wrote:
1. She didn’t say they took them. She said she killed them. The Others made them sick but in this last episode she says the monster did. So THAT may be a fluke:)
2. I am guessing he is going to go back or it would be pretty boring. Penny will go back with him to find out about the place SHE was born, since Charles stole her like Ben took Alex. My last sentence is just my theory. (Maybe stole her from a crazy bug eyed father…hee hee.)
3. I have no thoughts on this one…..
4. I think Jack’s dad had some connection with the island before. Whether he is related or is Jacob, or just someone special. I think he was supposed to die to go back to the island just like Locke is. Now he is kinda like representing Jacob, like reincarnation. I think that his life and Locke’s will later be parrallel to eachother. Not sure if I am explaining this right. Best I can say is I think that since Locke is helping the island, the island is going to give something back to him…everlasting life. I think Jack’s dad has done something in the same manner. I think Richard did the same thing as well. These are just my opinions.
3.
Comment 479, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
Thanks so much… most of my friends don’t watch Lost and I have been a fan since day one. I usually don’t read the blogs justso that I can form my own ideas but this past episode really threw me. Thanks for your insight!!!
Comment 480, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jamal wrote:
FWIW, I don’t think Christian Shepherd has BECOME pivotal, I believe he has been intrinsic to the baseline of this show since hour one.
It was NOT a mistake that he was a prominent part of the pilot, IMO.
: ) P
Comment 481, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
The Wrz wrote:
///////////////////
he saved locke from being crushed under the blast door in the hatch!.
Comment 482, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
///////////////////////////
yes? hammer.
Comment 483, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
phew !read to here and its only saturday morning . happy valentines day peeps.x
Comment 484, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jacob = Israel
http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com/view.jsp?artid=208&letter=C
John Locke = determinisim
http://books.google.com/books?id=TbcRAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA29&lpg=PA29&dq=john+locke+determinism&source=web&ots=npAF9_bipT&sig=yCZMpG8WtLUy2H_XuMjtZZyMZVE
Comment 485, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
gmta leah wrote:
++++++++++++
I just knew you were gonna do that. LOL
Comment 486, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJSander wrote:
++++++++++++++
Totally agree PJ, he has popped into the story several times. It just seems like we are seeing him more because now that the show has and end date, they can give us more about him.
Comment 487, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Jaime wrote:
++++++++++++++
After listening to the podcast a couple of times. I think that the wall surrounds the actual Temple. They were letting us know that technially what we saw was just a protection wall and that once you are inside the wall you have some hiking to do to get to the actual Temple.
Comment 488, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
This implies that smokie has a ‘weekend house’ or a ’summer retreat’ AWAY from the main temple. You know, a place to entertain foreign (French) dignitaries.
Comment 489, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
++++++++++++++
Funny Doc.
I just took it as the hole was just another Cerebus Vent like the ones we have seen on the blast door map and jig saw puzzle game.
Comment 490, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
Here’s my problem with blanket course correction–who is in charge of knowing what the RIGHT course is? God, Jacob, Hawking? If time is a string, say, to use Daniel’s words, and you can move back and forth on it– or rather, sometimes some people can– but we live our lives in one direction, birth to death, what’s your only option? It’s to figure out what Destiny (or whoever/whatever the mighty creator of the Time String is) has in mind for you, and do that.
Unless you’re psychic, and, granted, some on this show are, you’re the leaf in the wind of Fate, and good luck to you! Hope you’re good at reading the crumbs/signs Fate tosses in front of you, woe to you if not.
OK, I can buy that as a premise, but you’re only shot of Free Will is, fulfill your destiny or fight your destiny. And, BTW, sorry, if you fight your destiny, you’re toast anyway, because Fate’s going to drag you back in the direction it wants you to go.
Or, I suppose, disaster happens when you fight destiny and your only option is to, OK, course correct.
But, like the Ancient Greeks, tragedy be yours, and happiness is an accident which you’d better enjoy for its fleeting duration, because like the Delphic Oracle says, you’re going to kill your father and marry your mother and nothing you do to try to stop it is going to change that. Ha ha, human hubris, don’t mess with the gods!
That works and all, but it’s not my favorite thing.
Cheers–Liz
Comment 491, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I was thinking some more about Heroes–and wh
Hammer wrote:
****************
I wondered if CS was maybe once a potential hero who resisted the call of destiny, and tried to fight what the Island (or whatever) wanted from him, and became the drunk because of it. And now it’s Jack’s turn to face that moment–so far, not so good, so maybe it will rest with Aaron?
–Liz
Comment 492, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
I totally agree. The Frenchies got fried at a Cerberus vent… one we had not seen before. My question is – is there more than one Smokey? One per vent?
Smokey seems to have a varying mood at different times – good Smokey and bad Smokey suggests only two Smokeys to cover all of the Cerberus Vents. Maybe good and bad Smokey don’t get along… that’s why they are always racing around… not to get the Losties – but simply to beat the other Smokey to the punch. Maybe good Smokey kills bad islanders, and bad Smokey kills good islanders. That’s why Team Keamy lived following their butt-whoopin’ – bad Smokey let’em off with a warning.
(love to see Smokey vs. Smokey in the UFC octagon)
Comment 493, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Also along those lines, who did the show open up on? Not John Locke, Jack. So while John may do some important things, good or bad, I think it’s going to ultimately come down to Jack and what he chooses when the pivotal time unfolds.
I’m still thinking, Jacob’s chair in the woods, and ‘Help me’
–Liz
Comment 494, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
LOL–Cerberus was a three headed dog guarding the gates of Hell, did that get said yet? So maybe there’s three Smokies on a very long dog chain. sorry if repeat.
Comment 495, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Tasha wrote:
___________________________
And to follow up on Tasha’s reply, Rousseau also had told the Losties that the Others took her baby, Alex. So maybe that’s the part you’re remembering, Jamal.
Comment 496, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Hammer wrote:
_______________________
I haven’t listened to the podcast yet, but it’s somewhat of a relief to me to hear that we haven’t seen the temple itself yet. Like I mentioned in comment 224, I’d expect the temple to be a significant structure, and I’d expect it would get a more dramatic reveal. (kinda like the dramatic reveal of the Others’ barracks that we got in the Season 3 premiere)
Comment 497, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
PJ Sander Comment 320
Why would Ben let Walt leave?
So I think uses people for greatest Utility–given their unique abilities–on and off the island.
Ben had a “man on the boat” Michael. Was that the reason Ben let Walt and Michael leave? To have him the Freighter? We assumed so, but maybe didn’t discuss it enough (or we had fewer pieces to weave together than we do now).
Ben let Walt go because he either a)needed a “man” off the island, b)wanted to protect Walt from the crazy Time issues the rest of the Losties are experiencing, or c)like a, Walt needed a man in real time, but ONLY Walt was qualified.
Walt then is one of the good guys too. And knows it. It will be Walt in the end that is central to the Locke-Bentham transformation.
Comment 498, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LizS;
DocH wrote:
The Cerberus thing was big back in Season 2-ish. Vicious three-headed dog like thing that guards the Gates to Hades (I hear it’s like an exclusive celeb hang-out now. Tough to get in with Saddam as doorman) But Cerberus is always a conversation starter after a Smokey episode… or after a “good vs. evil” debate… or after a “they are all dead” debate.
- – - –
TK;
DocH wrote:
Me too. But I don’t know that it has to be above ground either. The various blueprints we have seen over 5 seasons suggest there is a significant underground complex. The Looking Glass episodes pointed to the novella about the Moon Pool… big-timey underground theme.
Comment 499, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
LizS Comment 364:
On not wanting your favorite characters Ben and Locke to not be viewed ultimately as “good” for the acts they commit.
I’m personally with you, that it’s hard to label someone Good, when they do the stuff these guys have.
I’m thinking it’s possible that the show’s construct is leading us to see them this way. It almost sounded like a gutteral growl when Christian was scolding Locke.
In my books, anyone who gives you an emotive like that is showing how much you’ve hurt or put at risk their core. They can’t help but release that kind aggression/disdain.
Comment 500, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Rita Comment 413
On Locke’s apparent leadership grooming by Ben.
Great post! I think you’re right, there is a free will/determinism thing at play. Now I’m thinking both sides want him.
One side–Jacob and the bad guys, want John Locke
The other side will get Jeremy Bentham. Ben will get Bentham. When Ben said “he’s not who we thought he was” he wasn’t lying. Ben is waiting for his Leader–Jeremy Bentham, the Utilitarian, one who accepts and understands all of Ben’s atrocious actions were morally justified. Together they will try to save X.
The bad guys want John Locke, who understands this island is theirs to own, control, and dominate.
Comment 501, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
K.C. Comment 423
On “actually changing the future” as the real goal for Locke/Ben/Desmond/Walt?
I think you might be right. To figure out how to change the future AND do so without the course correction.
Why Farraday tries.
Why Ben is apparently amoral (believes things are either necessary or irrelavent if time can be changed (and if he fails he’s dead anyway).
Why Walt and/or Locke is needed. There is only 1 or a few who have special ability needed by Ben (and others who understand).
Why Farraday made Desmond his constant, and why Ben is surprised now by Desmond’s role in all of this.
Comment 502, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Great posts!
Is Christian Shepherd a manisfestation of the smoke monster, (help me?)
Cool, my nosebleed question was answered by previous posts. Now I understand why Locke didn’t get a nosebleed. Wait! Okay, why hasn’t Jin been getting nosebleeds yet?
Okay, so do the 06rs really need to come back or not??? Claire and Charlotte both insisted they don’t come back! Sayid told Hurley to do the opposite of what Ben says. Charlie told Hurley that those on the island need him. Ben obviously knows how to come and go as he pleases, no sweat. I think I’ve concluded that Ben is just using them (06rs) for whatever the ultimate game is between him and Widmore. I like the previous posts about the “manifestations” and “whisperers,” too.
Some cool similarities between LOST and “A Wrinkle in Time,” by Madeleine L’Engle. Read about “A Wrinkle in Time” on wikipedia if you are interested. Cool to read about Stephen Hawking’s theories, too, and ponder relations to LOST.
I love it that Penny and Des named their kid Charlie!
Comment 503, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
P.S. Are the losties just going back and forth between 1988 and 2004? Kind of seems like it.
Comment 504, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
OOPS!!! Nope. Nevermind.
Comment 505, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Great thoughts all –
A few of my own, for now:
-Liz’s comment from above got me thinking of the parallels between Jack and Christian. Jack on island – confident leader, at home drunk and out of control. The same could be said for his dad, could it not? The Christain Shepherd on island is in a leadership position, off island drunk.
- Unrelated thought – I really feel like the noise associated with smokey is more pronouced each time we see it. It’s almost like it’s mechanical, sounding like a roller coaster or something. I don’t recall the sound of smokey as much in earlier episodes. I could be wrong – but is this some indication of how it works? Thoughts?
Comment 506, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Missy wrote:
Smokey’s been having that chain sound for its latter appearances. I think the thing we were suppose to learn about it (D&C state they will reveal something new about it each time it appears) was one of its exit points, guarding the temple wall.
Comment 507, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I’m wondering if there any meaning to people’s names or if the creators are just having fun. Locke, Hume (Desmond), Rousseau and even Bentham (Locke’s psudeonum when in LA) are all philophers of some fame. I even seem to remember someone named Kant at some point. Anyone else notice this pattern? Also, Christian Sheppard? Could there be a more obvious allogory?
Comment 508, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
Eric, I beg to differ on the Ben! But at least we can agree his actions have been atrocious ; )
You can’t convince me that poisoning an entire group of people, men, women & children, was justified. For a child to commit mass murder to make himself an acceptable leader to a people whose motivations, methods, and actions before and since have been hostile, murderous, mysterious, and seemingly self-serving–you tell me what the moral good is?
Protect the Island? Why, and for who, and from what?
Because the Island wanted him to? Yeah, not good enough. M U R D E R. A devastating crime, a soul-darkening act, a horrendous evil.
Why, why, why did they all have to die? Why did Alpert ask boy Ben to do it? That is just messed up. A tribal, primitive response to the Not-Us of pre-Civilized times.
Ben is a complex, interesting, strange and dangerous character, but if he’s doing something good, it’s not because he’s the moral compass of the universe. Maybe everyone’s on the same side at the moment because there’s a catastrophe to be averted. But when it’s over, and you become THEM again, look out!
Best, Liz
PS-But I won’t say Ben can’t surprise us. It’s part of who he is.
Comment 509, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
ChrisLost wrote:
I found this site,
http://www.mdx.ac.uk/WWW/STUDY/linkssh.htm
which is a Middlesex Univ. study link site for a lot of the names you’re talking about, with it looks like a lot of other cool science & social history stuff.
Are they just clever names for characters, or do they supply some deeper meanings for the story?
Hmm. Best, Liz
PS, not sure if I did the link-thing right, sorry if I messed it up
Comment 510, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
It seems like this episode will be this season’s emotional and mind blowing one, like “The Constant” was for Season 4.
Comment 511, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Lost TV Show wrote:
If you are talking about the upcoming episode, 316, then you may be right. Given that D&C have alluded to the fact that it is a “stand alone” episode, and thus will (in my opinion) probably be the one they use for Emmy consideration, I expect it should be fairly strong.
: ) P
Comment 512, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Thanks for the link Liz. I was actually a philosphy major (yes I admit it) and am finding it interesting that the show keeps introducing characters who are named after philosophers. I think we’ll see even more in the future. It made me think about the giant 4-toed foot from a few seasons ago. Could that be some sort of remnant of a giant Socrates/Plato/Aristotle? I don’t understand the 4 toes but the foot looked very “ancient Greek” to me. Are Richard and his crew looking to create some sort of Plato’s Utopia and these darned intruders (Dharma, the Oceanic crew) keep getting in the way? I wonder.
Comment 513, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
just watched lost !late again! well, no mysteries this week. …But what i will say is….Eloise hawkins is a baddy !I think she s going to become good though. as soon as desmund tells her that her son is on the island . i dont think she knows yet. And ben certainly didnt know that danial was her son.He knows its going to change things .Thats my two penneth.
Comment 514, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Eric wrote:
+++++++++++++++++++=
Maybe being able to change the past/future without course correction is how you change a factor in the equation (numbers)?
Comment 515, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I think this season has progressed very slowly, even though it slightly resembles older seasons. I think what made the first three seasons so good was because they were less action oriented, and I am hoping they go back to that.
Also, I do not think many questions will be answered, so do not get your hopes up.
Comment 516, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
I watched something on the science channel tonight about the 6 degrees of separation. The equation looked similar to the one Hawkins was writing on her chalkboard. I recorded it and I am gonna look more into it tomorrow but it said if you take a hub out of the equation/network it could have devastating effects. I feel the wheels turning in my head. How come everything I see and every conversation I have can somehow be related to lost?
Comment 517, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
Why did Dan tell Dez that “the rules don’t apply to you”. Here’s my theory: the O6 was “supposed” to crash on the island, but Dez wasn’t. Therefore, Dez can bend or break the “island” rules such as answering the hatch door for Dan and getting the “memory” in the future. Any thoughts?
Comment 518, posted 1 year ago - Quote and reply
DocH wrote:
Comment 519, posted 1 year ago -